Sunday, February 10, 2013

How difficult is the life of a brahmana? – article by Mr Ramanathan


In continuation of the discussion on Brahmins in the comment section of the previous article Kamal Hassan's Vishwaroopam as 'Bhasmasura'. I requested our guest writer Mr R. Ramanathan to write about the life style of Brahmins. I am thankful to him for obliging this request and sending me this article for publication.  On reading this article, one would know how it was impossible for a Brahmin to suppress others in the ways that are told by everyone from evangelists (St Thomas myth) to Dravidian thinkers and movie makers. The kind of Brahmins explained in this article did exist until a century ago, but today they are an endangered people.


In the course of the article, the writer has said that Brahmins abstained from eating onions and garlic and those who ate them had to do propitiation. It was not just Brahmins but all Hindus abstained from onions and garlic in ancient Bharat. This is known from the chronicles of the Chinese travelers Fa-hien and Hiuen Tsang.  Onions and garlic were cultivated only for medicinal use. Now on to the article by Mr Ramanathan:-

 

Today there seems to be a very wrong opinion about the life of strict Brahmanas and Brahmaniyam and it is assumed that it is an easy and lazy life and just living of "charity". I have heard people say that the life of a "Shastrigal" is the easiest to live and how fortunate these "Shastrigals" were. How unfortunate "we" were because "we" have to go to offices and obey a bosses orders!  I am not exaggerating and this was said by one of my relatives who works as a branch manager in a nationalized bank. On the contrary if a brahmana's life is lived as per the dictates of the shastras and the veda's ,  even after accounting for changes in yuga dharma appropriate for Kali yuga, it will not be an attractive proposition for today's mostly materialistic  brahmanas.  The dharma shastra says that if ever a brahmana is living a life of luxury and enjoying sense pleasures alone, without doing his dharma he is wasting his life and deserves to be branded and paraded on a donkey!!. The dharma shastra enjoins poverty (Daridra sthiti) for brahmanas. The Aruna prashna which is the first prashna of the Taittriya Aranyaka, states that they should be "Asanchayavan" meaning they cannot think of the morrow. They have to live by doing the 6 karmas enjoined upon them which are

1.      Adhyayanam(learning) of the 14 vidya stanas(4 Vedas+ 6 Angas+  4 Upa angas. This itself would drive away most of the brahmin people today)

2.      Adhyapanam(teaching)

3.      Dhanam(charity)

4.      Pratigraham(Acceptance of dakshinas at ceremonies)

5.      Yajnam(performance of sacrifices).

6.      Yaajanam(Officiate in others rituals)

A householder brahmana can earn money but if his wealth reaches a level that he can sustain his family for 3 years he is asked to perform the more elaborate shrauta yajnas that are highly expensive and at the end of which his resources are bound to be sucked of, without leaving a penny. Reading the Katopanishad, we find that Nachiketas father Vajashravaha, performed the Vishwajit sacrifice where every possession is expected to be given of as dakshina. So the ideal brahmana is not allowed to hoard wealth too beyond limits. Great brahma rishis like Vasishta were addressed with adjectives like "Taponidhee!" meaning one that has tapas alone for his wealth.  Thus it is very clear that brahmanas were expected to live a simple, austere life depending on society for livelihood and guide the society in education and spiritual values. If they failed the king would punish them by cutting of their shika. This disallowed them from doing any one of the 6 karmas stated above, thus being deprived of their livelihood. This is the same as death.


Typically he is expected to get up around 3.30-4.00am in the morning and since the time he is awake, his actions are regulated by the dharma shastras. Even the way he gets up from his bed, the way he has to answer natures calls, bathing sandhyavandanam, japam, Aupasana/Agnihotra for a householder etc. are regulated and is not left to his wish. The list is too long to mention. For details please read any book on the dharma shastra like the Vaidyanatha Deekshitam.  In addition he has to do the above 6 karmas, the Vaishvadeva ceremony where offerings are given to all beings: - beasts, birds, men, even to pishachas, rakshasas, and even to adharma devatas(Refer to the Vaishvadeva mantras of the Mahanarayana Upanishad in the Taittriya Aranyaka). The idea behind this is that no being should go hungry as far as possible. When all this ends, it is about 3.00pm in the afternoon when he has food.  Remember there was no concept of breakfast in Ancient Bharat and there were no 2-minute noodles, ready to cook & eat stuff etc. So, not even one morsel of food would go in till 2.00-3.00pm.


It is more difficult when there is a pitru rite on somedays like the shraddha or tarpana. Note these have to be performed only during the aparanha kaala (middle part of day). Not at 7.00am in the morning as is being done now. After this is over and after the midday bath (compulsory for householders and vanaprasthins),  other rites like pooja etc are to be done.  There are too many occasions like this and it can fill an entire page. Remember I have not even touched the food restrictions for brahmanas. Just to mention, if a brahmana "accidentally" ate onion or garlic he was asked to undergo a very tortuous fast called Chandrayana as expiation.  From the above it can be seen how difficult a life of a true brahmana is. It is surely not the "What do you plan to do for the weekend!!!" kind of life and I don't think such a life would be envied by anybody today.


There may be a question that "Where do brahmanas live like what you say, today?" Yes I will be honest; 99.99% of them do not. But I know a dozen of people who still live such a life in very remote villages and I have personally spent time with them. Their presence radiates a feeling of inner peace, contentment and in my case I felt ashamed of my current materialistic life. Most of them are great Vedic scholars who have read more than one veda along with the angas and many are lifelong Agnihotris and perform shrauta sacrifices. But their down to earth simplicity and unassuming nature and indifference to materialistic wealth are really stunning. 


As a real life example of the last point, one of the brahmanas was officiating at a soma sacrifice in his own village, when news reached him that his small patch of sugarcane caught fire and he needed to rush back. But he refused to budge stating that "Even if you roll on a heap of sand, with your body full of oil whatever sand can stick will stick and the rest will fall down".  He reminded me of Janaka who was unperturbed even when Mithila was on fire. There is a deekshita in Ramanathapuram who is 88 years old and he still gets up at 3.30 am and takes bath in the well in his backyard and does his Sandhyavandanam on time, performs aupasana and other agni karyas. He has never given prayashcita argya(given when sandhyavandanam is performed late after sun rise. However this is the norm than the exception these days) since he had upanayanam and started to perform sandhyavandanam.    Now you may ask me why on earth people should subject themselves to such torture.  I can tell you that the senses and the mind are restrained and as a result inner peace & satisfaction and the courage to face life with equanimity results.


Can present day Brahmins return to their earlier lives? The answer is yes and no. "Yes", because with a great effort and re-aligning your value systems you can do so. Again there are examples of this I have seen. Many brahmins working in software companies have given up their jobs and went back to agraharas in villages and taken up veda adhyayana. But the point is you need to be financially independent for this. But then you should be ready to sacrifice your comfortable job and city life for this. "No", because the latter is impossible for the majority. Earlier the society took upon itself to support such brahmamanas who lead life of tapasvis and taught the vedas without expecting dakshinas etc. Now with absence of such support it is better to be financially independent and then venture to take up such a life. But remember the brahmanas whom I mentioned earlier did not go for jobs and fortunately for some of them, the next generation did not go to school and did only vedic study and are continuing their traditions. One Agnihotri from Mathur in Karnataka even told me proudly that his vamsha, since the time of Manu has never seen the inside of a school and did only veda adhyayana.


The great Shaivite saint Thirugnanasamabandar sings, "Long live the Brahmins, May there be copious rains, long live the king. May the name of Hara spread everywhere"  This does not  apply to present day Brahmins but to brahmins who live a strict life of Aachara, who were Shrotriyas and brahmanishtas, who were not affected by desires, who maintained sacrificial fires without allowing them to extinguish, who unfailingly did all their shastraic duties assigned till they breathed their last. And this involves all that I mentioned at the beginning of the article. Surely not the life coveted by brahamanas these days!

 

 Related articles:-

Were Brahmins bad? – a sequel to Karunanidhi's hate-Brahmin speech. (Part -1)

95 comments:

Kudanthaiamudhan said...

Visvaroopam movie is like a documentary movie.i doubt about kamalhassan statement about his having spent 95 crores money for this movie as most of the scenes were copied or taken out in different angle with new graphic technology from english movies.

In the very first scene itself this dirty actor abused brahmin ladies by telling " she likes chicken, i like her, paapathi ( D k persons used to call brahmin ladies like this word ), pl tell me whether salt and red chillies are correctly added " as if brahmins are more fond of chicken as depicted in this scene.

when if anyone calls dalit by name of his caste, he can be arrested. why brahmins do not have guts to protest while most of the online bookers in the first one week shows were mostly from brahmin community only. The younger generation do not care but admire this dirty fellow who has no morality in his personal and in public life. Let T N brahmins association file a case against him. JJ told in the tamil nadu assembly daringly " i am a brahmin by caste " . i suspect that kama-ill Ass-an actor invested the black money of his loving yellow shawl leader funds in this movie and hence tried to please his master by calling brahmin ladies as " pappathi " in this movies first scene itself.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Kudanthai amudan,

Agreed with your points except the unparliamentary (may be for my blog)expression of a certain kind. Sorry to this, but I have great respect for you Sir.

In connection with what you said I think I can reproduce here a forwarded article from an unknown writer. It asks,"If 'pariah' is against the law, how can 'paapathi' be lawful?" The writer must have included Santhanam too in the list.


// Kamalahasan has made anti-brahminism the leitmotif of his money-spinning career in films. And in TN. the more insulting and derogatory of brahmins, the better for the market. They have all done it - actors, actors cum politicians, politicians cum script writers like Karunanidhi, Satyaraj, MGR and blooming idiots like Vivek who pass for comedians have gotten away with anti-brahmin scenes and dialogues.

What goes around comes around. Kamalahasan's Vishwaroopam is in the news as being a story about terrorism. It also has a typical Kamalahasan anti-brahmin scene where the man tells the heroine who plays a brahmin girl to eat a chicken and tell him how she finds it. Only he calls her "paapathi". And not a word about this!

Paapathi is dravidian abuse for brahmin women. Never mind the etymological roots of the word, today it is not merely pejorative, it is outright abusive. Some years ago, maybe around 12 or 14 years ago, the DK had painted "paapathi ai podu udamai aaka vendum", meaning brahmin women should be made common property on walls around Chennai.

Pariah too has a cultural etymological root - deriving from 'Parai' a kind of drum. The pariahs are the traditional drum beaters in temples, messengers. Notwithstanding the history, it is an offence under the law to refer to the scheduled castes as 'pariah's.

And the woman in Vishwaroopam not only does not protest at being called "paapathi" she even eats the chicken.

So if 'pariah' is an offence, how can 'paapathi' be lawful?

Leela Samson, any answers? //

Badari Narayanan V T said...

Nice post. The life mandated for Brahmins is more rigorous than army training. By controlling the senses, one attains spiritual bliss. Tamil has a wonderful word 'asadu' to describe people like Kamal. The word cannot be adequately translated. One just dismisses contemptuously such people without second thoughts

KODHAYIN PADHAI said...

I think it is very difficult to practice the way our forefathers lived in the olden days.And, it may not be necessary in present surroundings and circumstances. Let those claiming to be Brahmins, at least, take vow that they will not live dishonestly;never act against Dharma; chant vedas or holy texts prescribed to them in their tradition; help as much as possible fellow citizens;never trade their learnings for money;be truthful.
This list can be refined and expanded. But the point is, irrespective of what the likes of Karunanidhi and Kamal Hassans say, if the Brahmins maintained their way of living, people would always respect. This I have seen in practice. Though I can not boast of all the qualities I listed, even mere tilak and dhoti [panchakacham] made many in North India and in south to greet me with folded hands [which, I felt, I did not deserve]. I mentioned dhoti for panchakacham, as what all people were in our daily life is called lungi in North. They never appreciate such a dress, especially for Brahmins.
So the point I am trying to convey is we should ignore and be indifferent to these very bad comments, and simply go ahead with our vowed life. Honest living will earn all respects, even from unbelievable quarters.
TG Saranathan

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Saranathan,

//Let those claiming to be Brahmins, at least, take vow that they will not live dishonestly;never act against Dharma; chant vedas or holy texts prescribed to them in their tradition; help as much as possible fellow citizens;never trade their learnings for money;be truthful.//

Completely agree with this observation. I think these were the basics for the Brahmins in olden days also. This is equally applicable to all other people too. There is a verse in Paripadal saying that since because Brahmins did not sway from Dharma (right path), others also did not sway. Atleast now, let there be an awareness among Brahmins and others on adherence to basic codes of righteousness.

Narayanan said...

Dear Madam,

A good start in shedding some light on the duties and responsibilities of the Brahmin community, which was in practice till a century ago. Let this article open the eyes of the misguided people who ignorantly repose faith on the theories of dravidavaadis.

The non-observance of these duties by the present-day Brahmins, though an act which is detrimental to their community and the society, must not be singularly attributed to them, as the changes in political and social setup have mainly contributed for such a situation. On the other hand, any member of brahmin community who practises his noble duties even partially must be encouraged and respected.

Kanchi seer had enlightened more on this subject which is published in "Deivathin Kural" Part-2. The link to the online discourse is give below ( for those who can read Tamizh):-

http://www.kamakoti.org/tamil/2dk29.htm

http://www.kamakoti.org/tamil/2dk72.htm

rk said...

Dear Madam
I am an ignorant soul and my apology upfront for my doubts.
1)My query: is being a Brahmin birth based? It looks like all rituals and restriction mentioned in the article was applicable to a select group of people born into a certain caste. This shows at least to some extent in the past that being a Brahmin was based on his birth rather than on his Gunas. ( Varnam) But Krishna says in Gita that you are not a Brahmin because of your birth. I am confused.To whom these strict rituals and rites were prescribed? To Varna based Brahmins or birth based Brahmins?
2) Is Yagna equivalent to sacrifice? A lot of Hindus including myself are uncomfortable with this term " sacrifice". It sounds like a ritual where some animals are sacrificed into the fire. I am sure Aswametha yagna did not mean horse sacrifice.
I would appreciate your opinion and comments.
Thank you Madam.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr rk,

I requested Mr Ramanathan, the writer of this article to respond to your questions. His reply carries weightage as he is learning Vedas for years and also taking part in yajnas. His articles on Vedic yajnas are already available in my blog. I think I can have his articles as a separate archive. I will do it. You will get to know the exact nature of yajnas from those articles.

pratap ar said...

Dear Rk,

Pls find the links from deivathin kural,the discourses given the 'walking god' Sri parmacharya on the necessity of varnashrama dharma,the life of a brahmin,importance of heritage and tradition in veda chanting.The links are in English below

http://kamakoti.org/hindudharma/part3/chap6.htm
http://www.kamakoti.org/hindudharma/part3/chap7.htm

Necessity of tradition by birth and the importance of chanting the Vedas

http://www.kamakoti.org/hindudharma/part3/chap8.htm

jayasree said...

Mr R Ramanathan has sent his response to Mr rk's queries. It is given below:

"
Dear Mr Rk,
I am Ramanathan a native of Madurai and working in Bangalore. I am doing Veda adhyayanam of thje Krishna yajur veda shaka along with some of the angas in the traditional way. So Jayshree madam asked me to respond to your query sir. Let me tell you that what I know is very little and limited. But I will be frank in my response and it will be based always on what the Veda and dharm shastras say. This may be a long reply so be prepared.

Generally while in doubt on some topic on dharma. The following order is generally followed. The authenticity and validity decreases as we as we go down.


1. Vedas
2. Smritis(composed of the dharma shastras, kalpa and grihya sutras)
3. Itihasas(This is where the Geetha is)
4. Puranas
5. Shishtachara(Conduct as per people established in dharma)


As Manu says “Vedas are the root of all dharma”. The smriti is valid as long as it does not contradict the vedic statements. Now with this background I proceed to answer your queries.
1)My query: is being a Brahmin birth based? It looks like all rituals and restriction mentioned in the article was applicable to a select group of people born into a certain caste. This shows at least to some extent in the past that being a Brahmin was based on his birth rather than on his Gunas. ( Varnam) But Krishna says in Gita that you are not a Brahmin because of your birth. I am confused.To whom these strict rituals and rites were prescribed? To Varna based Brahmins or birth based Brahmins?


As short answer to your query, yes Varna is birth based. To understand this you must understand that this is based on the idea of rebirth. If you do not believe in this concept there is no point in this discussion. The moment rebirth is taken out of the equation it becomes meaningless. When Krishna states that varna is based on guna, he does not mean he created 4 varnas and anyone can enter into any varna based on Guna. It is Eshwara who decides who goes to what varna The reason is because a person’s guna can change with his circumstances and also his aptitudes. Also how do you know what is the guna of the person till a mature age say 18.

(cont'd)

jayasree said...

The shastras mandate Upanayanam for a Brahmin boy at the age of 7. Is it possible to determine his guna at that young age? Leave upanayana, there is a samskara called Jatakama that needs to be performed just at the time the placenta is cut off. If the varna is not known, what are the mantras that should be used? The mantras differ by varna. This is the same with all the 42 samskaras. Also suppose it is decided that the guna of a person is predominantly brahminic and later sometime he sees a king (Kshatriya) or Vaishya and wants be one of them, rather than suffering as a Brahmin, should he become one?. When will he learn the military arts of combats, at a late age say 25 or 30?. Or a vaishya decides that he is tired of his business and decides that he wants to be a brahmana and learn the 4 Vedas. One Veda takes about 7-12 years to learn. If he ends up desiring to be a brahmana at the age of 40 can he do the previous task? The rituals mentioned in the article are prescribed for brahmana varna and varna as per Veda and smriti is decided by birth. As for the concept of “Varna based Brahmins” it is purely imaginary. A mischievous western idea that has nothing to do with the dharma spoken of in Vedas and smritis.

Also Krishna says that better death than others dharma. What does this mean? If you could just jump between Varnas why would Krishna say this? Another example, as per the Yajur veda, the Brahmana can alone perform the brihapsati sava sacrifice. The Kshatriya alone can perform the Ashvamedha and Rajasuya. Can a brahmana suddenly desiring to do the Rajasuya, become a king say at the age of 35, conquer his enemies and become and emperor? (This is required for the performance of the Rajasuya as did by yudhishtra) and do the Rajasuya? So the idea of “Varna based Brahmins” sounds ridiculous actually going by the above arguments. To reiterate it is a western concoction by “gurus” who pander to a western audience.


(cont'd)

jayasree said...

Also I said that in my article that the people who followed these things have been doing for generations. Since they are required to do these from birth, they are established in these things very deeply and not tempted to waver. So the son of those persons who sees his elders doing these things automatically gets pulled into the groove. Also due to this there is no over saturation of any one profession and no competition.


Also Krishna says that “The shrutis and smritis are my commands and I will ignore anybody performing nay act not in conformance with it”. This being the case how can there be the concept of a “Varna based brahamana”. With varna determined by god alone at time of birth. Note that a Brahmin in this birth need not be a Brahmin in the next birth depending on his actions.


Now it may be asked that how did Vishwamitra become a brahmana from a Kshatriya? Is it possible to jump like that? Yes (again my own view) it is possible to. But if you read the Ramayana where the story of Vishwamitra becoming a brahma rishi is given in detail, you see the amount of tapas performed by him. It not possible for us to even think of such things in even a dream. So for all practical purposes it is like pulling a mountain with a string and trying to move it. If you see Yudhishtra preferred nonviolence even being a Kshatriya himself whereas, Ashvattama being a Brahmin liked to fight. Also if you read the Mahabharata, you can find the story of Dharmavyadha a butcher. His knowledge makes him more of a brahmana than a butcher. But he never said he would want to take up the svadharma of the brahmana varna and remained as a butcher.

From all this the, only explanation we can give is that due to some transgressions committed in a previous birth, these people fall down. This is the case of dharmavyadha. He was a Brahmin in his previous birth and he helped a hunter to hunt and ended up being a butcher in the next one. So if you see the concept of Varna is based on rebirth alone.

2) Is Yagna equivalent to sacrifice?

A lot of Hindus including myself are uncomfortable with this term " sacrifice". It sounds like a ritual where some animals are sacrificed into the fire. I am sure Aswametha yagna did not mean horse sacrifice.

No as per the definition, yajna is defined to be naval of the universe. When doing it physically it may involve dedicating certain materials to deities. Please read my other articles in the blog where I treat it in detail."

jayasree said...

On 'sacrifices', I would suggest a reading of my old article and the comments in the following link

http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2009/11/animal-sacrifice-how-veda-dharma-views_06.html

ASHISH said...

Pls ref your comment in the essay "Animal sacrifice – how Veda Dharma views it?"
{On Indra I have done some analysis which is available in Tamil in my series on Thamizan thiraavidna.}

Will it be possible to provide an English translation for the benefit of readers not versed in Tamil.

Sincerely yours,
Ashish Raje

Maddy said...

@jayasree
According to Aryasamajis vedas strictly prohibit Killing of animals even during performing Yajnas.
Request you to go through the following video http://agniveer.com/no-beef-in-vedas-film/

Ashwamedha:Ashwa here is Kingdom or Nation and not horse.Medha doesn't mean killing.Ashwamedha refers to for the well being of Nation.

If vedas say killing of anials is adharma but to do something good vedic sacrifices(animals) should be performed is totally contradictory.And Vedas don't have contradiction.
So Ashwamedha,Gomedha,Naramedha doesn't mean sacrifices animals or humans.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Ashish,
I will get them translated into English soon.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Maddy,

Think you are a new visitor to my blog. Kindly refer to the article on Aswamedha by Mr Ramanathan.

http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2012/11/the-ashvamedha-yajna-guest-post-by.html

Do Vedas prohibit killing animals? The last verse of Chandogya upanishad holds the answer. "Ahimsan sarva bhUthani anyatra thIrthEbhya:" ( never giving pain to any creature, except at the tîrthas) ThIrtha means fire / sacred place / sacred object / place of veneration. Means yajnas.

In my article on animal sacrifices, I would have written how to view this. Vedas talk everything under the Sun. Even the method to lure a woman is told in atharva vedas. But that does not mean people must use that. Vedas tell about the science of everything that is possible. But the one aspiring to attain the highest goal of human life (attainment of oneness with Brahman) would not use them.

From my article on animal sacrifices:-

//The ever lasting result is the attainment Moksha – or the state of no –rebirth or communion with the Supreme Consciousness which is variously called as Sat, God, Ishwara, Brahman, Satyam etc.
It can not be attained by the above means of yajnas that show cruelty to animals.

Those who desire Supreme communion are also shown the way by Vedas which is done by means of mental yajna – meditation, japa etc.
The Choice is left to man.

In the former, the good and bad karma connected to that yajnas attach to the person for whose sake the yajna is done. He will be reborn to undergo the effect of pains caused to the sacrificed animal.

In the latter, one has to sacrifice even the punyam and all dharmas so that one is not reborn.


This is the essence of Vedas given in 2 parts – the former told through Poorva mimamsa (also known as Karma khandam) – on methods of doing yajnas to attain desired goals and the latter told through Uttara mimamsa (also known as Gyaana khandam) which is about soul's search about the Eternal Truth so that one rises above mundane searches and meditate towards attaining Final Emancipation.


This is the gist of Vedas.
If some one goes the mundane way and does this or that sacrifice, that is not the mistake of Veda dharma.

But Veda Dharma's aim is to see that all rise above the mundane searches and reach Him.


Einstein's discovery can be used to make an atom bomb to destroy the world. It can also be used to cure a remote disease. It depends what use we put into.

We must look at the yajnas and sacrifices such as Ashwa medhas in this paradigm.

Just for having discovered his theory, Einstein could not be faulted for the drop of atom bomb.
In the same way, for recording the ways of ashwamedhas etc, Vedas and Hinduism can not be faulted.


Everything is recorded and dealt with in Veda matham. Veda matham also tells what we must aspire for – through teachers, gurus, rishis, Upanishads, Brahma sutras and numerous texts such as Gita. It depends on the mental make up of the person in choosing.//

jayasree said...

A related article in Tamil written by Malarmannan, an associate of Anna durai. A few days ago he left us for the eternal Abode.

http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2009/05/tamil-brahmins-article-by-malarmannan_21.html

Excerpts from this article:-

//நாõட்டுப்புறங்களில் நாட்டாண்மை செலுத்துவோர் பெரும்பாலும் பார்ப்பனர் அல்லாதோராகவே இருக்கக் கண்டேன். இவர்களுக்குத் தலையாட்டும் சிப்பந்திகளாகவே பார்ப்பனர் இருப்பதும் கண்டேன். உதாரணமாக விழாக்களில் முதல் மரியாதை பெறுபவர் பார்ப்பனர் அல்லாதவராகவும் அந்த முதல் மரியாதையை பவ்வியமாக அளிப்பவர் பார்ப்பனப் புரோகிதராகவும்தான் இருப்பார். சாமி என்று அவர் அழைக்கப்பட்டாலும். அழைப்பவர் குரலில் அதிகார தொனிதான் இருக்கும். பிறகு ஏன் பார்ப்பனர் தனிமைப் படுத்தப் பட்டு எதிர்க்கப் படுகிறார்கள்? விவசாயமே முக்கிய தொழிலாக இருந்த அக்கால கட்டத்தில் நிலச் சுவான்தாரர்களாக இருந்தவர்களில் பெரும்பாலானவர் பார்ப்பனர் அல்ல. நில புலன்கள் ஏராளமாக இருந்த பார்ப்பனர்களில் பலர் குத்தகைக்கு அவற்றைக் கொடுத்துவிட்டுத் திண்ணையில் சீட்டாடிப் பொழுது போக்கும் சோம்பேறிகளாகத்தான் இருந்தனர். பெரும்பாலும் விவசாயக் கூலிகளாக வாழும் தாழ்த்தப்பட்ட மக்களுடன் , அவர்களைத் துன்புறுத்தும் விதமாகவோ, அவர்களின் உழைப்பைச் சுரண்டும் வகையிலோ நட்ந்துகொள்ளும் வாய்ப்பு பார்ப்பனர்களுக்கு இல்லை. பார்ப்பனர் அல்லாத குத்தகைதாரர் மற்றும் சிறு நில உடமையாளர்கள்தான் பெரும்பாலும் தாழ்த்தப்பட்டவர்களைக் கொடுமைப் படுத்துகிறவர்களாகவும் அதற்கான வாய்ப்பு உள்ளவர்களாகவும் இருக்கக் கண்டேன். பிறகேன் பார்ப்பனர் மீது அத்தனை துவேஷம்?


மிகவும் யோசித்துப் பார்த்ததில், பார்ப்பனருக்கு அடுத்த நிலையில் உள்ள பிற சாதியாரை கல்வி, அரசாங்க உத்தியோகம் ஆகியவற்றில் பார்ப்பனருக்குப் போட்டியாக இயங்குவதற்குத் தூண்டிவிடும் பொருட்டும் தாழ்த்தப்பட்டோரிடையே அவர்கள் மீதான வெறுப்பைத் திசை திருப்பி விடுவதற்காகவும்தான் பார்ப்பன துவேஷ செயல் திட்டத்தை ஈ வே ரா வும் அவரது முன்னோடிகளான பொப்பிலி அரசர், டி எம் நாயர், தியாகராய செட்டியார் முதலானோரும் வகுத்து, வெற்றிகரமாகச் செயல் படுத்தியுள்ளனர் என்பது தெரிய வந்தது. இவர்கள் அனைவருமே கல்வி உத்தியோகம் செல்வச் செழிப்பு ஆகியவற்றில் பார்ப்பனர்களால் எவ்விதப் பாதிப்புக்கும் இலக்கானவர்கள் அல்ல என்பதும் புரிந்தது. கல்வி, அரசாங்க உத்தியோகம் ஆகியவற்றில் பார்ப்பனர் அல்லாத பிற சாதியாரும் வாய்ப்புப் பெற வேண்டுமெனில் பார்ப்பனர் மீதான துவேஷத்தைத் தோற்றுவிக்காமல் ஆக்கபூர்வமான வழிகளில் அதனைச் சாதித்திருக்க முடியும். ஆனால் துவேஷத்தைத் தூண்டுவதன் மூலம் இதில் துரிதகதியைத் தோற்றுவிக்க முடியும் என ஒருவேளை அவர்கள் எண்ணி விட்டனர் போலும்.


ஒரு குறிப்பிட்ட சாதியாருக்கு எதிராக அவர்களின் சமயம் சார்ந்த பிற சாதியாரை ஒன்று திரட்டி ஒரு துவேஷப் பிரசார இயக்கம் தொடங்கும் முயற்சி தமிழ் நாட்டில்தான் தோன்றியது. குறிப்பாக ஹிந்து சமயத்தின் குருமார் ஸ்தானத்தில் இருப்பவர்கள் பார்ப்பனர்தாம் என்ற எண்ணத்தில் அவர்களை செல்லாக் காசாக்கிவிட்டால் ஹிந்து சமயத்திலிருந்து பிற சாதியாரை வெகு எளிதாகத் தம் மதங்களுக்கு இழுத்துக் கொள்ளலாம் என்கிற எண்ணத்தில் மத மாற்ற சக்திகள் பார்ப்பன துவேஷத்தை உற்சாகமாக வரவேற்றதில் வியப்பில்லை. ஆனால் இந்த சக்திகளுக்கும் தமிழ் நாட்டில்தான் பிடிமானம் இருந்தது. பிரத்தியட்ச நிலவரப்படிப் பார்த்தால் சமூகப் படிக்கட்டுகளில் பார்ப்பனர் இருந்த இடம் மேலாதிக்கம் செலுத்தத் தக்க தலையாயதாக இல்லை. அதிலும் குறிப்பாக நாற்பதுகளிலும், ஐம்பதுகளிலும் கல்வி, அரசுப் பணியிடங்கள் ஆகியவற்றில் பார்ப்பனரின் எண்ணிக்கை கன வேகமாகக் குறையத் தொடங்கிவிட்டிருந்தது.

ஆனாலும் பார்ப்பன துவேஷப் பிரசாரம் வேகம் குறையாமல் தொடரவே செய்தது. சமுதாயத்திலுள்ள எல்லாவிதக் குறைபாடுகளுக்கும் பார்ப்பனர்தான் காரணம் என்பதுபோல், சமூகத்தில் பார்ப்பனர் இல்லாது ஒழிந்துவிட்டால் எல்லaம் சரியாகிவிடும் எனப் பிரசாரம் செய்யப்பட்டது.//

jayasree said...

Picking out this line from Mr Ramanathan's reply, let me add what I know:

//Note that a Brahmin in this birth need not be a Brahmin in the next birth depending on his actions.//

We are just hopping from one body to another in the series of births. Birth into a Brahmin family is not always a guaranteed one, same as how birth in the family of any other caste would not continue in future births also. From Nadi readings that I have come across I have observed certain features. They are as follows:

# An act of compassion to any life, done with selflessness makes a person born into a highly evolved Brahmin family where he / she is exposed to religious and spiritual thought right from birth. This is not the case with all Brahmin families of today. However there are families where such an environment exists conducive for spiritual thoughts. The selfless act of compassion gives him / her the karmic result of being born in such a Brahmin family where he / she would get more exposed to or groomed in the values of spirituality without material cravings.

# One of the oft quoted instances in srivaishnavite literature is that of a rat that accidentally tripped on a failing lamp in a temple thereby making the wick glow better. By this act, the rat was born as a princess in the next birth!

# One of the stunning Nadi readings that I came across was a Brahmin in this birth who was a Muslim chieftain in a previous birth!! Owing allegiance to his Muslim creed, he was engaged in destroying Hindu temples and converted Hindus into Muslims. In the birth as a Brahmin he did exhibit warring and aggressive qualities, but was devoutly engaged in ritualistic life of a Brahmin without any deviation. The stunning coincidence is that in the birth of a Brahmin, he was instrumental in renovating Hindu temples due to his profession. The other part of past action also got manifested with his children converting to other religions - much to his distress.

I dont know what his next birth is going to be or whether he would be born a Brahmin again. It may be something else also. But what struck me was the adherence to a creed - be it Islam or Hinduism - had continued to be his Guna and it had paid its rewards. On the other hand, the agony and distress that he had caused to others had come back to him and he had to experience what it feels like when his offsprings coming from a staunch Brahmin family chose to convert.

(cont'd)

jayasree said...

(continued from above)

# Yet another reading that I came across was of a Vaisya (born in a traditional cloth merchant family but deviated from family business and started jewellery business) belonging to Kongu nadu in a previous birth was born in a core Brahmin family in the next birth. In the previous birth he had donated liberally for building and renovating temples. In the next birth as Brahmin, he was entitled to do the same as the officiating priest of Kumbhanhishekams of temples. This connection is so striking that what he did in a material way for the establishment of temples by standing away from deity, came back to him as one who can touch the deity and do whatever is needed to establish the sanctity of the temple in a spiritual way.

# Yet another Nadi reading that I came across is about a person born in kingly family of Kerala who actually did not become the ruler but was devoted to improving the lot of temples and temple festivals. In the next birth he was born in a devout Brahmin family, was engaged in Vedic learning and was predicted to leave the cycle of birth after this birth.

# Yet another reading was that of a woman who was born in Puduvai (present day Pondychery) Nayak family. The next birth was in a Vaisya family in kancheepuram. the birth after that was in a Brahmin family in Srirangam at the end of which she is supposed to have left the cycle of rebirth. A common feature running in all these 3 births is 'compassion' and feeding anyone who comes hungry. She made no discrimination between people when it comes to showing compassion and giving food.

In the birth in Pudhuvai, she lost her husband and after that was only engaged in visiting temples (pilgrimage) and attending to children around her. In the next birth as Vaisya, she was naturally endowed with spiritual thoughts and was capable of applying discriminatory sense of perception and knowledge (written as Vivekam in the Tamil Nadi I read). Her habit of feeding the poor continued in this birth also. Though she did not make any discrimination to people when it comes to feeding, it is mentioned that she did not have any truck with lowly people (alpa buddhi people). Lowliness means mean mindedness as per this description. This also shows that there is no lowly class, there are only lowly people.

This idea (of what is lowliness) is written by Thiruvalluvar in Kudimai adhikaram where he does talk about the 4 varnas and the highly born and the lowly born in all the 4 varnas. May be I will write about it some time. What is implied is that there is no difference as high or low between varnas. It is only the numbering as the first varna, second varna and so on. It is like the numbering of Vedas with Rik as the first one, Yajur as the 2nd one and so on. But in reality it is my understanding that Atharvana Vedas was the oldest of all and Rik Vedas was the recent of all. It is by the content with reference to spiritual issues that the numbering as first, second was done. Same with varna numbering. The lowly and highly born are there in all varnas is something which we must all understand.

jayasree said...

In continuation of the above comments let me also state that there are astrological yogas that state that by merely serving the devotees of Shiva or Vishnu, a person would be born with high spiritual knowledge in the next birth itself and get released from the cycle of births at the end of that birth itself. This shows why our ancestors - particularly in Tamil Shivite and Vaishnavite traditions, kept insisting that it is enough to do Bhagavatha kainkaryam (service to devotees) rather than Bhavath kainkaryam (service to God). (adiyaarkku adiyaar - servant of servants of God)

Another yoga called as 'Vrinji yoga' tells about the previous birth act of helping in sustaining Vedas and Vedic yajnas. By this even if a person of the 4th varna who prepares the ground for the yaaga-shaala with utmost dedication would be born with naturally endowed spiritual knowledge in his next birth - whatever varna it may be- and leave the cycle of births at the end of that birth.

Those who without any expectation (one must renounce even the craving for Punya or moksha while doing these acts)cleans the temple premises, takes care of the temple premises, helps in procuring materials such as samith, ghee etc for the yajna, helps the Vediks who are doing the Yajnas and so on would be born in Vrinji yoga in the next birth and attain moksha after that.

It is interesting to note that in the year 2014, the combinations for Vrinji yoga are going to be present in the sky. As per this yoga, the person must be born with Jupiter and Saturn in own house or exaltation or friendly house and in kendra (1,4,7,10 houses) or Kona (1,5,9 houses)to each other and to lagna (birth time) and lagna lord. Between June 20th and November 1st, 2014 both Jupiter and saturn are going to be in Kendra to each other and in their respective exaltation. Interestingly the gyana karaka Ketu also will be in Gyana sthan, Pisces at that time. The children born in this period with proper position of lagna and lagna lord are going to wonderful persons with Vrinji yoga. Those planning kids at that time, kindly take note of my article on astrological factors for conception of a healthy baby. It can be read here:

http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2010/05/astrological-factors-for-conception-of.html

Unknown said...

As Jayashree mam puts it, The vedas have all karmas and concepts related to the 3 gunasSatba, Rajas and Tamas. There are even provisions given in regular soma yajnas for Abichara karma(black magic), but the performer is bound to bear the responsibility of the consequences.To clarify the Ashvamedha the Rajasuya and Gosava, that do involve animal sacrifices are not allowed in kali yuga. As per my opinion & experience, there are animal sacrifices involved in shrauta rituals. The Apastamba shrauta sutra as descriptions of such sacrifices, and doing them is considered to bring welfare to the worlds. I know there will be opposition to this. The Brahmasutra says: "Asuddhamiti cen na sabdat". The performance of sacrifices
is based on scriptural authority and it is part of the quest for Self realisation. Manu states "Veda vai dharma moolam akhilam", The vedas are root of dharma for the world. So when the shruti says certain yajnas require animal sacrifices, can we question it. Ofcourse if we do not accept the authority of the shruti, then there is not point of debate. For a detailed explanation read http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/2011-July/027992.html

Maddy said...

I'm not saying its fault of the Vedas that one understood the meaning of the mantras differently.But as we saw when sacrifices were performed in the name of Vedas even Buddha has criticised.So one who(most of the general public) doesn't know the real meaning start to hate Vedas.

jayasree said...

Dear Maddy,

Please refer the link

http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/2011-July/027992.html

in which Kanchi paramacharya's explanation is given. In the beginning of that link there is some info on Buddha too.

ASHISH said...

I came across following news in this week:
1)Finmeccanica deal put on hold after bribery arrest of Italian CEO:
India has suspended payments to Italian defence group Finmeccanica SpA for a $750 million helicopter deal.

2) Defence, welfare & road spending to be slashed. The cuts will reduce spending by about
Rs 1.1 lakh crore in the current financial year.

Expenditure is main source of corruption & it is P Chidambaram as FM who presided over the plunder of nation for almost a decade has to slash spending. Viz. It is ironic plunderers have been compelled to become guardians of nation’s wealth if not for the time being.

Esoterically, do you envisage the above news reflect the Saptarshis “Kavach” for Bharat against onslaught of corruption of rapacious plunderers. Could you provide astrological interpretation of the above news.

You may consider my request quixotic.

Ashish Raje

jayasree said...

//You may consider my request quixotic.//

Yes :)

I am watching the justice system / executions and now scandals in the Vatican with the movement of Saturn. With Saturn turning retro from 18th onwards, let us watch how things develop.

rk said...

Dear Madam
Thanks for clarifying the matter. My inference from reading the feedback comments:( Apology for any misunderstanding on my part)
1) All the strict rituals prescribed in our holy scriptures are meant for " BIRTH BASED BRAHMINS" only.
2) There are animal sacrifices in Vedas (whatever the reasons/justifications behind them.)
3)It is almost impossible for anyone to become a Brahmin in spite of leading a satvic compassionate life. Viswamitra was an exception.
I just wonder what the true definition of " Brahmin" is.( Cho's " Enage Brahaman?" was thought provoking drama series)
Another point. I am sure 99.9% of present day Brahmins are NOT following most of the rituals. Hence, in future ( births) the numbers will automatically will decrease due to the Karma effect.Am I right?

Unknown said...

Dear Mr Rk,
I will answer your points one by one
RK:1) All the strict rituals prescribed in our holy scriptures are meant for " BIRTH BASED BRAHMINS" only
Ram: Sir there are no other Brahmins except by birth. There are no "Varna brahmins" and that's just an imaginary concepts. I am living in India and when we mean brahmins we mean people who are by birth atleasr brahmins. It is kind of new to me and sure it will be the same way for people in India that there are varna based brahims. So your statement "BIRTH BASED BRAHMINS" is totally wrong.

RK:2) There are animal sacrifices in Vedas (whatever the reasons/justifications behind them.)
Ram:Yes they are but many of them are not possible or prohibited for kali. But some of them are being performed and yours sincerely has witnessed many such performances.

RK:3)It is almost impossible for anyone to become a Brahmin in spite of leading a satvic compassionate life. Viswamitra was an exception.

Ram: Why not?. People born in to the brahmana varna can, by doing their duties as enjoined in the scriptures. Also please understand the aim of life is not becoming a Brahmin. Because in the next birth one can fall into other lower births. Just attaining birth in the brahmin varna is of no use, until the dharma of the varna is followed and the mind is purified for brahma jnana. It is just that the among the 4 purusharthas the brahmana varna is asked to concentrate on dharma and moksha, with some allowances for regulated kama. Other castes are allowed to have artha & kama also in their course. But the aim of a brahmin is moksha. Of course people in other varnas have also attained brahma jnana. For example Vidhura(A shudra by birth), Janaka(A kshatriya by birth), Jada bharata(A kshatriya),Prakshit of Bhagavata fame(A kshatriya). Also all the kings of Raghuvamsha after leading a dharmic Grihsatha life, go to the vanaprastha life and attain moksha through yoga. Kalidasa in his Raghuvamsha maha kaavya says about the kings of the solar dynasty
"In their boyhood the learnt what is to be learnt beyond doubt.
In their youth enjoyed regulated sense pleasures.
In their old age the became munis and attained moksha through yoga".

Please understand that, though the only focus of the brahmana varna is dharma and moksha, moksha is by no means the exclusive property of brahmanas alone as shown in the examples above. No need to become a brahmin to attain moksha. It is not prohibited for other varnas

RK: I just wonder what the true definition of " Brahmin" is.( Cho's " Enage Brahaman?" was thought provoking drama series)
Another point. I am sure 99.9% of present day Brahmins are NOT following most of the rituals. Hence, in future ( births) the numbers will automatically will decrease due to the Karma effect.Am I right?

Ram: The only immediate simple definition of a brahmana is one who has got all the 42 samskaras from birth, performing veda adhyayana, performing the duties appropriate to the ashrama he belongs to. For example Markandeya was a brahmachari. So his duty was to do vedic study & penance till he attained moksha. If one is a grihasta perform all rites and rituals associated with it and so on. But finally all this should lead to the purification of the mind and final brahma jnana and jivan mukthi. As for the question of the no of brahmins decreasing it may be true. But it can be brought to life back by a group of dedicated brahmanas following the dharma to the fullest.

Hope i have clarified your questions

jayasree said...

Dear Mr rk,

First of all no mention of apology Sir. All of us are here to learn, share and grow in our knowledge. See how our learned readers are bringing to our notice valuable information on Vedas and Paramacharya's explanation for them. Our perception grows better with this sharing of knowledge.

//1) All the strict rituals prescribed in our holy scriptures are meant for " BIRTH BASED BRAHMINS" only.//

For this question, I wish Mr Ramanathan replies, as he is well read in this subject and articulates better than me.

In my understanding Yes. There is a verse in Chandoghya upanishad which is uttered by the father of Sweta Ketu saying that there were none in their lineage who were not Brahmins just by name sake, but were Brahmins by way of life. This shows there were even at that time birth based Brahmins who did not follow the way of life (adhyayanam) of Brahmins. As Mr Ramanathan said, the birth based identity comes even at the time of cutting the umbilical cord. To live as a Brahmin which begins after Upanayanam, the Brahmin must do the prescribed rituals. To use the words of Sweta ketu's father, Brahmins of today are Brahmins by name sake - that is by birth. Mr Ramanathan's explanation concurs with this.

(cont'd)

jayasree said...


//2) There are animal sacrifices in Vedas (whatever the reasons/justifications behind them.)//

I would rather prefer to say that Vedas do not need any justification for the animal sacrifice. I think you read Paramacharya's explanation. From my limited knowledge I would quote 2 pramana, (1) chandogya upansihad saying that himsa is not allowed anywhere except for Vedic purpsoes and (2) Ahimsa is the supreme dharma (Mahabharata). Using Paramacharya's line of argument, both these sentences carry merit, and does not mean that one is good and the other is bad. But Ahimsa is far better than himsa of vedic rites. But where a Vedic rite is required to be done for a common cause, himsa can not be done away with. That is how we must see.

In this context, Ramanuja darsanam has got something to say. (It was originally called Ramanuja darsanam / outlook of Ramanuja and not srivaishnavism). Ramanuja says that all these yajnas have limited merit. That is, once after the merits of the yajna are exhausted, the person has to start from square one, or where he was before. This does not give him the eternal merit told in Vedas. The eternal merit is to experience Eternal Bliss and not to get back to cycle of births. This cannot be achieved by any yajna whether they involve animal sacrifice or not. The maximum that a Vedic yajna can guarantee is to go to Swarga. (Paalai Gauthamanar, a Tamil sangam poet went to Swarga with his wife in a yajna funded by Cheran king, for whose sake he penned 10 songs of Pathitrup patthu) But there again, once the merit of the yajna is over, he had to be reborn on earth.

So Ramanuja says what use of those yajnas. Is it not better to do that yajna which would give one eternal benefits? It is for this the yajna of the mental nature, in which one sacrifices all the punya and papa to God - which is possible by assigning everything to God thinking that God does everything through us and therefore the paapa and punya of what we do are not ours but His. This idea is reinforced by the concept of Sharanagathi - surrender to God.

It must be noted that the above thought of Ramanuja applies to yajnas done to fulfill one's desires. This is not applicable to yajnas done for common welfare. Any Vedik can not question such yajnas done for common welfare even if it has animal sacrifice.

(cont’d)

jayasree said...

In the case of animal sacrifices, it is clearly told that the one for whom the sacrifice is done, would undergo the karmic effect of the killing. Knowing this very well, the kings had done the sacrifices for the sake of welfare of the land. Lack of personal gratification was there in those times, but it started declining in course of time. Today we are in an age where such sacrifices are not to be done, because there is no one who is capable of doing them in the original spirit.

//3)It is almost impossible for anyone to become a Brahmin in spite of leading a satvic compassionate life. Viswamitra was an exception. I just wonder what the true definition of " Brahmin" is.( Cho's " Enage Brahaman?" was thought provoking drama series)
Another point. I am sure 99.9% of present day Brahmins are NOT following most of the rituals. Hence, in future ( births) the numbers will automatically will decrease due to the Karma effect.Am I right?//

This debate of who is a Brahmin and whether only those who strictly adhere to rituals prescribed for Brahmins can be called as Brahmins – was discussed even 1000 years ago as we can see it in the olden text called “Acharya Hrudhayam”. Let me highlight some of the salient points discussed in that book in the connection.

(cont'd)

jayasree said...

There always existed Brahmins who strictly adhered to Brahmanic way of life. They used to do all the yajnas. They do these yajnas for Loka kshemam ( welfare of the world / people). They can not be and must not be faulted for doing their rituals strictly and doing yajnas where animals were sacrificed. They are doing it as ordained by Vedas. They are known as ‘Karma- nishtas’. It is not possible for many people – other Brahmins to live like them. These people have been mentioned as “mikka vEdiyar” , “jaathi anthaNar”, “thIyOmbu kai maRaiyOr”, “ThuNai noolmaar vilanthaNar” etc by Alwars. They are “varna – Dharmi” – those who follow varna dharma of their respective varnas. It is because of them the world gets rains and other benefits. Athiratra is one such yajna that can be done by these Varna dharmis or Karma nishtas. They can not be faulted nor they can be abused. When we say that we must protect Vedas, it includes them also. These Karma nishtas are indeed birth based Brahmins . Without a birth identity, they can not have become varna dharmis.


Other Brahmins who take upanayanam, are indeed getting a chance to pursue the varna dharma or to be a karma nishta and do yajnas for the sake of humanity. Most of them do not pursue this line. So they just remain as birth based Brahmins and not Brahmins by way of life (recall the words of Swetaketu’s father).

In the book Acharya Hrudhayam, it is said that janma visesham (birth based nature) makes one a Brahmin but if he does not have “Bhagawad Bhakthi” then he can not be regarded as a Brahmin. (chapter 1-38) . Even if he knows sastras but lacks faith in Bhagawan, he can not be called as a Brahmin even if he is born to a Brahmin couple. The stress is on “Bhagawad Bhakthi”.

A logical extension of this premise is that the one who has bhakthi is a Brahmin! This is further explained in verse 1-90 where a vachan is quoted “ na shudra bhagawad Bhakthaa: Vipraa” Bhagawathaa: Smruthaa: sarva varnEshu thE shudraa: yE hyabhaktha JanaardhanE” .

It means to whichever varna one may belong to, if one does not have devotion to God, he is a Shudra. This explanation had existed 1000 years ago – at a time when Bhakthi movement reached its peak. Most of the contributors to that period were not Brahmins but were Bhakthas. So this makes me think that the question of who is a Brahmana was in vogue even at that time and was settled by acharyas.

Even this book named as Acharya Hrudhayam means the Mind of Acharya or Guru. The Gurus or teachers of 1000 years BP have held that only those who have no bhakthi were Shudras. If a birth based Brahmin lacks Bhakthi, he
is not a Brahmin but a shudra.

I think based on this the birth based Brahmins can make clear choices depending on the constraints of circumstances. Where they can follow rituals prescribed for them, it is better to follow them. At no time they can not give up devotion to God.

Those who are not birth based Brahmins, can live the life of a Brahmin (recall Swetaketu’s father’s words) by devotion to God and adherence to the way of life suitable for devotion –such as food restrictions, vrathas and adherence rituals wherever possible.

narayana said...

Shri RK, This is what I have learnt from my Acharyas.

According to Sanatana Dharma, varna gets determined by birth. However, birth is only a "necessary" condition and not a "necessary and sufficient" condition. Being born to Brahmana parents makes one eligible to become a Brahmana. But, a person becomes Brahmana ONLY through his conduct and strict adherence to the NITYA KARMAS prescribed in Shastras. According to my sampradaya (Dwaita), one MUST do trikala sandhyavandana to maintain Brahmanatva. A person who misses doing sandhyavandana for one full day (i.e. missing all the three) loses his Brahmanatva temporarily until a Prayaschitta homa is done. Hence, the insistence from Acharyas and elders to do Sandhyavandana without fail. Therefore, as per this prescription, it can be safely assumed that a majority of "Birth based" Brahmanas are not Brahmanas as defined by Shastras. Over successive generations, if the same trend continues, even kids born to such couples in the future will NOT be Brahmanas as per Shastra. Therefore, Brahamanatva is a function of both birth and Aachara.

Now, to your question on whether someone not born in a Brahmana family can become a Brahmana, the answer can be found in Bhagavata and Bhagavad Gita. When God says "Chaturvarna maya srishtyaa Guna Karma Vibhagasa", guna refers to birth and karma refers to strict adherence to duties. Anyone lacking in either one or both IS NOT a Brahmana. As per the 7th Skanda of Bhagavata, Narada instructs Yudhishtira that, when a person not born to a Brahmana couple follows the rituals and leads the pious life ordained for Brahmanas, he can be considered a Brahmana. Note that, in this case, he doesn't become a Brahmana, but he should be respected and treated like a Brahmana.

"Yasya yal laksanam proktam
pumso varnabhivyanjakam
yad anyatrapi drsyeta
tat tenaiva vinirdiset"

More importantly, as Smt. Jayasree very nicely elucidated, being a devotee of Lord Narayana is the sure shot path to Moksha. Vishnu Dharma Rahasya states that

"Narayana Namastestu Naama Mudraankito Naraha
Drushtyiva Labhate Muktim Chandaalo Vaa Brahmaghatakaha"

This means, "even merely seeing a Nara (note the word Nara and not "Brahmana") with Narayana Mudra on his/her forehead is enough to guarantee moksha even for sinners who have committed Brahma Hatya", what to speak of the merits obtained from serving the Lord Himself.

Thanks,
Narayana

narayana said...

Namaskara Smt. Jayasree,

After reading your thoughts on Virinchi yoga, I have a question on the planetary configuration in 2014.

1. What is the effect of a retrograde saturn in Libra? I heard that retrogression in an exalted house is not a good combination in the natal chart. Is that correct? Please advise.

jayasree said...

I wrote
////1) All the strict rituals prescribed in our holy scriptures are meant for " BIRTH BASED BRAHMINS" only.//

For this question, I wish Mr Ramanathan replies, as he is well read in this subject and articulates better than me. //

Mr Ramanathan has replied to this and his comment appears just above my comment where I have stated the above sentence. The ID "Unknown" and "Ram" carry the comments of Mr Ramanathan, the writer of the above article.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Narayana,

Your comment adds a new leaf to our understanding of Brahmana birth. Thank you for the same.

On retrogression of saturn, yes, in predictive horoscope for individuals, retrogression reverses the sthithi of the planet. That is, if the planet is exalted, it would behave like a debilitated one in retrogression. In friendly house it would be malefic and in enemy house, it would turn more malefic. The rationale is derived as follows.

Imagine the planet as a person positioned in own, exalted, friend's house or enemy's house. When the person becomes vakram (coarse / corrupt / stunted / aggressive)if he is in his own house, his house would bear the brunt of his aggression. It also means where he is supposed to enjoy peace and respect (own house), all that would be spoiled due to his vakree nature. Apply the same logic to other positions like exalted, friendly and neutral houses.

But in enemy's house, the reverse is not as above. Already the person is housed in the enemy;s house. His potency to bring out something positive out of himself is severely restricted there. One must check the angle between this person (planet) and owner -planet also in this regard. When the planet turns vakram in an enemy's sign, it can not make positive out of a negative. It can only show its bad side and become fierce to fight out its place in the enemy's house. By this the bhava significance of that house is severely affected. It is like the adage, when two elephants fight, it is the grass that suffers. The native suffers in such a vakram.

However the same vakram is an added advantage in increasing the longevity granted by the planet. The longevity attributed by a retrograde planet is trebled. If a person has more planets in retrogression in his natal chart, we can straight away say that he is a long liver. But no guarantee that he would have a calm life.

In Nadi methods, the retrograde planet is treated as one having gone to the previous sign and predictions are made for the planet from that sign - by taking into account the retro effect as well.

In mundane astrology, retrogression of long term planets is harmful. If it enters the previous sign in retrogression, the entry time would cause havoc in the respective significance. 2G scam broke out only in one such retrograde shift to another sign by Jupiter.

However if the retrogression happens in enemy sign, it enhances the positive power of the planet. For example the second half of 2012 had all the features of natural calamities such as massive earthquakes and man made calamities such as terror attacks, But Jupiter's position in Taurus where the features of natural calamities and terror attacks were focused in angles to it, its retrogression had given a protective shield. So we have to analyse on all counts and can not make a blanket statement.

Presently Saturn's sojourn in exaltation in an airy sign, in a airy star is enhancing the airy saturn's positivity. This brought out justice system to work well. All scandals are coming out in the open for people to see who were the corrupt ones. I think it is due to the current motion of Saturn, even the vatican bank scandal is threatening to explode anytime now. The Augustawestland chopper deal corruption also has come in the open. (chopper - airy)

Now what is going to happen when Saturn is going to become retro? My case is that it would stamp the wrong doers. There is no one to check its march now. Rahu, its co traveler in Libra, is its buddy only who would also be following him from behind. Only in fiery signs, retro planets become fatal. But in signs of its own nature and in a sign of Justice like Libra, I believe saturn would go in full throttle. I expect the true faces of many corrupt people would get exposed. Lets wait and watch.

rk said...

Thank you Madam for the detailed explanation. Thank you Mr Narayanan for your wonderful response.

Skandan said...

Respected Madam,
outside to the present discussion, i am just posting this comment just to bring to your notice, i came across this gentlemen (punyaatma) by name Krishnadas. He is doing a great service to sanatana dharma and bakthi yoga in US. He is been nominated last week to Grammy awards for chanting Shri.vishnu's name. I thought i shd share this with you if you have missed. His Hanuman chalisa chanting is just mesmerising everyone. He arrnages something called Bhajan boat where ram nama japa is done in the boat.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRNFedd05qk&list=UUtzvMbKEud7MqkIVdFjfHXQ

http://www.krishnadas.com/

God Bless him
regards
Skandan

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Skandan,

I didn't know this person and the Grammy nomination until you brought it here. Thank you very much.

On hearing him sing, the following thoughts crossed my mind. How wonderfully Bhagawan establishes Himself even at remote places (to Bharat varsha). We think that we are doing everything as though we are the custodians of Hindu dharma, but it is He who makes things happen.

एवमेतत्पुरावृत्तमाख्यानं भद्रमस्तु वः || ६-१२८-१२१
प्रव्याहरत विस्रब्धं बलं विष्णोः प्रवर्धताम् |

viShNoH balam pravardhataam = let the strength of Vishnu increase!.

The Vishnu balam is ever present in the world and gets itself established time and again.

The other thought is "sangeertha Narayana shabda maatram, vimuktha dhukka sukhino bhavanthu". Singing of Narayana naamam removes the ills and makes the singer experience bliss. How true!

Skandan said...

Respected madam,

Yes. what you said is 100% true. This team is really doing a great service in terms of kirtan, bhajan and chanting. Ramadas, shyamadas, krishnadas and Jai uttal, deva premal. all are americans. They all have picked up good hindi, sanskrit, they have adaopted vegetarinism. they beleive in Guru Kripa. Minimum of 200 to maximum of 20000 people attend his bhajans. mostly americans. all that they do is chant ram or vishnu or om namasivaya. They have two trusts. Seva foundation and Hanuman foundation. They have done more than 3 million cataract operation freely in asia only. they have changed their names for their family also.. girija, lalitha, uma etc. I sometimes feel, bagavan is not just establishing himself in remote places, he is slowly moving out side baratha varshaa. We have hanuman chalisa sung by Madam MS so gracefully. But we dont appreciate that. They are able to appreciate the same. when they do somehting, thye do it whole heartedly. they dont do when it is convenienent to them. when muslims mention mohammed's name, "they say peace be upon him". The same way, we shd also say regualrly "
viShNoH balam pravardhataam"

God Bless
Pranams
Skandan

Unknown said...

Yes Mr Skandan
What you say is true. They do what they want to do, whole heatedly. This reminds of an incident. It happened in the chaturagiri temple in the western ghats. I was there on a week day and i saw a westerner from Scotland. He was meditating near the Linga and that point of time no one, except for me and him where there in the whole forest.I was doing my evening sandhyavandanam at that time. He meditated for nearly 1.5 hrs without any distractions. After sometime a group of pilgrims came. They were our people. They were just loudly chattering, singing rude cinema songs and playing FM radio on their cell phones. I could not help noticing this contrast. I slowly got into conversation with him and asked, how he could meditate for so long without distraction, while the other people who came, could not even remain quiet for even a moment. The reply he gave is worthy of being equated with any traditional,advaitic/Vishitadvaitic/dvaitic bhasya of the brahma sutra. He said that it was we Brahmins who had to show the way and we had failed to do so. As the Brahmana Varna failed to be an example, how can you blame the others?. Also he said that without Indriya Nigraha(Sense control. He used the same words!!!)people would continue to suffer. He said he was tired with the western way of life and wanted to leave it and immerse himself in study and yogic contemplation. But unfortunately we Indian were getting westernized. He shook his head in disgust as he said it. He actually seemed shy and introverted but when he spoke, his words had a very profound depth of thought.

According to me he would get a brahmin birth next time, whereas most of the Brahmanas in India(including yours sincerely) would end up in lower births like animals and plants!!!. This experience affected me for almost a week after i returned back to humdrum routine life.

It is sad to notice the kind of changes happening in this great Bharata Barsha, whose forests once were resounding with vedic chants by brahma jnanis and yogis like Vashishta, Vyaasa, Shuka, Jada bharata etc. Is it really in this land where rishis like Uddalaka, Nachiketas once lived?. Hard to believe considering today's situation. It aches for me, whenever i am reminded of this incident. Even though i come in the gotra of kashyapa prajapati, the great mantra drashta of yore, i am not doing my svadharma as per the shastra and working in a company. But the Westerner whom i saw, is doing what i am supposed to do. I am totally ashamed!!!.

narayana said...

Thank you for the detailed explanation on retrogression, Smt. Jayasree.

Could you also please explain the effects of combustion (asthangata)? Parashara states that combust planets are in general very ineffective. However, what about a scenario where let's say, Shani is asthangata in the 10th house for a Vrischika lagna native? Would this scenario be beneficial for the native instead of affecting his career (because of shani's presence in 10th house).

I also came across another horoscope of a Vrischika lagna native with 5 planets and Rahu in 10th house. Shukra, Shani and Budha were all asthangata. Guru was also in 10th house aspected by a full moon. Does this native have Parivrajaka yoga?

Any general pointers you can give with regards to interpreting effects of asthangata planets would be very helpful.

Thank you.

pratap ar said...

Dear Jayasree Mam,

It is also noted there is a lowering of moral standards more specifically among the females of the brahmin caste.A lot of materialistic demands from them and a reduction in their number along with a lot of intercaste marriages has led to a huge demand to marry ladies of brahmin caste.I tend to beleive that this trend should be effectively halted/reduced to promote dharma and satvic/brahminic way of life as stree is the root factor in helping maintain dharmic way of life.

jayasree said...

From Mr Balaraman>>

Dear Jayasree Mam,

I would like to make my comments on the article of Mr Ramanathan as under but I am unable to get it passed through the comments window. Sorry for the inconvenience.

Regards.

Bala

==My Comments==

One point I thought off while reading about Vishwamitra becoming a brahmin being an exception is this: In your tamil dravidana series you had mentioned that not all brahmins could become vedic scholars and carry out the 6 primary duties assigned to them - studying & teaching vedas, performing yagnas, getting them done, seeking alms and giving donations etc.

That being the case, you had given the second set of 6 duties for them being the top, middle and bottom responsibilities in sanskrit and tamil languages respectively.

Just for arguments sake can non brahmins today try the second set of 6 duties diligently and become brahmins over a period of time since as per Mr.Ramanathan the first set is impossible for them?

I am asking this question after reading the view of Mr. Ramanathan that a person becomes a brahmin by birth only. This mere thought is enough to make the dravidavadis to castigate the brahmins without them trying to understand the basis of karma, rebirth etc.

On the other hand it is really hard for learned brahmins to convince others about karma, reborn as a brahmin on the basis of doing service to god in the last birth etc.

In today's scientific world such thoughts are hard to pass muster, in whichever way you may try to convince others by giving reference to astrological readings such as virinji yogam etc.

Management guru Peter Drucker had said in his book "Effective Executive" that anything complicated will make management very difficult. This is because the common people have limited capabilities as compared to the experts and hence all the management rules have to be made very simple so as to make them understand them so that they can carry out the duties easily.

Hence top managers have to work very hard to make things simple to achieve good management in any institution whether it is a business entity or government or society itself.

Our vedic dharma principles are so complicated that one can understand why it is so difficult to manage with conflicts developing everywhere.

To their credit our rishis and munis had made the rules in such a way that the common people had only to follow the various rituals as told to them by the learned brahmins to lead a dharmic life. But educated persons dismiss such "rituals" easily since they want proof in everything. They also resent being over lorded by brahmins.

The Manu dharma or the chaturvarna principles were clearly the excellent management tools of our ancient "management gurus" namely our rishis and munis! But due to the passage of several centuries the system has been corrupted enormously, so our present day vedic gurus will have to find a way to make the common people understand our dharma and live by its principles in today's world. Is it possible?

In a lighter vein I can understand one point in his writing: brahmins have been assigned so strict a regimen as to make them ignore sensual pleasures. This is the only area where we brahmins of today are really brahmins, meaning we keep totally silent whenever we are insulted or ridiculed by tamil film makers not giving vent to anger!

Bala

Unknown said...

Dear Mr Balaraman,
Thanks for the interest in the article sir. What i meant in the article is that birth alone plays a major role, in getting the samskaras needed for performing the duties of a brahmana. But the person should continue to do his dharma for his brahmaniyam to bloom to the fullest extent. Or he is just called brahma bandu(A namesake only brahmana)
As for your question as to whether other castes can become brahmanas by the secondary set of 6 duties, the answer is they can be consider equivalent to them but cannot become one, since samskaras start even at the time of marriage. A samskara called the "Garbhaadhanam", is performed for the bride and after that only the "shanti muhurtam"(god only knows what does it mean!!) is performed after a minimum of four days atleast(A samskaric wedding for brahmanas is supposed to take place for 4 days). All these rites are essential for the conception of a brahma nishta as per the shastra. I asked the question "Why are there no brahma rishis born in this age?" to a senior and learned deekshita(He is affectionately known as kulitalai periavaa).He said that it was due to the lack of proper samskaras that brahma rishis are not born these days. So as you see the samskaras start before even the birth of the child. Since for other castes these are not performed, they are not strictly brahmanas though by the above way of life you have suggested, people can be considered equivalent to a brahmana and might be born as a brahmin in the next Janma to continue their spiritual quest.

As for convincing dravida vaadis or anybody else, scientists or otherwise, i would not bother to do it. Not everybody gets to understand everything. The depth of ones dharmic life does not depend on the acceptance and refusal of anybody but on ones own conscience and faith. There are many people living such a dharmic life as per the Vedas and Shastras. They should be the example for anybody who would want to sincerely lead a dharmic life.

Instead of wasting time to convince dravida vaadis and others i would prefer to practice dharma to the maximum extent possible in this age and have a regret in mind for not being able to do it completely. If there is such a sincere longing in the mind, Shriman Narayanan or Shri Pashupati would surely bless us with more conducive conditions. I have seen many loukika oriented brahmanas lamenting the lack of time. But they do not think twice about reading useless magazines, newspapers, seeing TV, talking on their cellphones for hours. But when it comes to performing Nitya karma, somehow they blame kaliyuga for all its evils and they say just doing Nama japam is fine and is equivalent to sandhyavandana or performance of 1000 Asvamedha sacrifices.

One more point i would want to re-emphasize. For those for whom performance of sandyavandanaA etc is are enjoined as per varnashrama, it is mandatory to do it and there is no replacement for this.

To give an example, let us say a king has 2 servants. One servant does not talk much, but goes about doing the duties assigned to him by the king. The other servant just praises the king sky high but escapes doing the duties assigned to him by the king. Now between these 2 servants who will be the kings favourite?. So if the shruti which is the breath of the lord commands people to do their Varnashrama, it is better to do it to the maximum extent possible, than to escape from doing it using Naama japa and sankeethana as an
excuse.

Only in times of leisure in between performance of ones dharma, are these kinds of activities enjoined. If you see most of the puranas have been recited in the free time available between various sessions of shrauta yajnas. When the time for those duties came, the sessions was stopped and purana shravana continued later.

Hope this answer clarifies your questions

Ramanathan

Kadambari said...

I totally agree with Mr.Balaraman's statements.
I believe that all new age religions including Buddhism had come up in order to reach the common masses to "Keep it Simple". Unfortunately the Science that was hidden in the Hindu religion ended up being too complicated for the common people. The upkeepers of the religion (read Brahmins) lost the significance and possibly the will to fight it out and retain / spread the knowledge.
Very few acharyas are able to transcend the resentment and ignorance and reach the masses.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Narayana and others,
Sorry for the delay in replying. Due to preoccupations I could not respond immediately.

Mr Narayana told,

//Could you also please explain the effects of combustion (asthangata)? Parashara states that combust planets are in general very ineffective.//

Yes, Exceptions are malefics. Look at the lordship. If 6th, 8th and 12th lords become combust, they lose their malefic nature.

//However, what about a scenario where let's say, Shani is asthangata in the 10th house for a Vrischika lagna native? Would this scenario be beneficial for the native instead of affecting his career (because of shani's presence in 10th house).//

I belong to the school of thought that there is no asthang dosha to saturn and no planetary defeat to Mars.

//I also came across another horoscope of a Vrischika lagna native with 5 planets and Rahu in 10th house. Shukra, Shani and Budha were all asthangata. Guru was also in 10th house aspected by a full moon. Does this native have Parivrajaka yoga?//


Please refer Brihad Jataka by Varahamihira. There is a chapter on Pravrajya yoga.

jayasree said...

//pratap ar said...
Dear Jayasree Mam,

It is also noted there is a lowering of moral standards more specifically among the females of the brahmin caste. A lot of materialistic demands from them and a reduction in their number along with a lot of intercaste marriages has led to a huge demand to marry ladies of brahmin caste. I tend to believe that this trend should be effectively halted/reduced to promote dharma and satvic/brahminic way of life as stree is the root factor in helping maintain dharmic way of life.//

Yes, I must say that there is a kind of crisis in the marriage issues among Brahmins today. It is there in other castes too – something PMK Ramadoss has been vociferous about. I know I am stirring up a hornet’s nest by my following observations.

Exposure to western culture and thought has shaken our system of family and family ethics. Love marriages have been always there, but not like today. If we look at the ancient Tamil society, as seen from sangam sources, love marriages were there only on the basis of same Kulam, same basics and same everything. There are quotes available from many commentators of 1000 years ago on Thirukkural and Tholkaappiyam on this. By and large, the love affairs were not outside the community or with someone who did not enjoy acceptance from the parents. Even in the Ayar (cowherds) community of which we have many instances of love affairs, the boy must fulfil the family expectations of the girl (must do bull fighting to marry the lover) . Behind all this was the control of senses for both men and women. They would not lose their heart to a person – who would be unacceptable to the parents and wherever they had lost their heart, it was deemed as divine sankalp. Today, mere lust decides the affairs. This trend has penetrated all sections of the society.

Speaking on Brahmins, I think the problem is something else. There are more Brahmin boys remaining bachelors while the Brahmin girls wield the power of choice. The mothers of the present generation girls were the first generation of educated or employed girls in their times. Most of them faced harassment by their in-laws. They literally led the life of a bonded labour by earning, spending for the family of the in-laws (could not spend for their own parents) , did all house hold chores with no help or sharing coming from in-laws and husband. Now they are guiding their daughters from their experience. It is all a season of reversal of what you did coming back to you.

Today the boy’s family is ready to adjust to any extent just to get their son married to a girl. The trend will change from generation to generation. The present generation girls need family support to raise their kids. So in about 2 decades we may find joint families becoming the norm. When elders are around taking care of children, there will be some effective check on the ways and thoughts of children.

From my interactions with people, I would say that most inter caste marriages involving Brahmin girls have been disastrous. Divorce is on the rise. Where parents have been clear in their thoughts of how they must raise their kids, this issue is not relevant. This applies to any parent from any caste. Upbringing and indoctrination on family values do play a role in reducing the incidence of inter caste marriages.

I don’t subscribe to inter-caste marriage. This was discussed in an article earlier and in its comment section. The link is

http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2012/02/caste-is-not-curse.html



narayana said...

Thank you, Smt. Jayasree. I am still learning preliminary aspects of astrology and hence the many questions on this topic.

Smt. Jayasree said

//Yes, Exceptions are malefics. Look at the lordship. If 6th, 8th and 12th lords become combust, they lose their malefic nature//

Let's say Budha and Shukra are ashtangata in the 10th house for a Vrischika lagna native. Budha has lordship of 8th and 11th. Shukra has lordship of 7th and 12th. In such a scenario, can we consider combust budha and combust shukra to be benefic?

//I belong to the school of thought that there is no asthang dosha to saturn and no planetary defeat to Mars//

Can you please throw more light on this topic? What is Parashara's dictum on this?


//Please refer Brihad Jataka by Varahamihira. There is a chapter on Pravrajya yoga//

I was not able to understand whether ashtangata planets also bestow Pravarajya yoga on the native. In the scenario I described, one of the horoscopes I looked at recently has 5 planets and Rahu in 10th house aspected by a full moon. Horoscope is of a Vrischika lagna native with Guru, Budha, Shukra and Shani in the 10th along with Sun and Rahu. Budha, Shukra and Shani(?) are asthangata. Please explain how I can analyze whether this native has Pravarajya yoga.

On a different note, I have seen quite a few people scheduling cissections basing on the horoscope of the to-be-born baby. Is this allowed as per our Shastras? I know shastra recommends muhurtas for grabhadana, nisheka and even for surgeries. But, are we stretching this recommendation too far by timing cissections?

Please advise

Unknown said...

Should we we not be ashamed of this?. When British kids can learn and chant the vedas and chant beautifully we be-little it

See the link below

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4kdjHFBvd4

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Narayana,

//Let's say Budha and Shukra are ashtangata in the 10th house for a Vrischika lagna native. Budha has lordship of 8th and 11th. Shukra has lordship of 7th and 12th. In such a scenario, can we consider combust budha and combust shukra to be benefic?//

Yes, but their other lordships would suffer (11th and 7th)

//Can you please throw more light on this topic? What is Parashara's dictum on this?//

I am not keen on writing on astrology in this blog other than what I think is necessary for general purpose and general public and wherever applicable, to remove superstitions and misconceptions about astrology. By this I mean to convey that I am not keen on writing on dictums of astrology.

// //Please refer Brihad Jataka by Varahamihira. There is a chapter on Pravrajya yoga//

I was not able to understand whether ashtangata planets also bestow Pravarajya yoga on the native. In the scenario I described, one of the horoscopes I looked at recently has 5 planets and Rahu in 10th house aspected by a full moon. Horoscope is of a Vrischika lagna native with Guru, Budha, Shukra and Shani in the 10th along with Sun and Rahu. Budha, Shukra and Shani(?) are asthangata. Please explain how I can analyze whether this native has Pravarajya yoga. //

There are 2 good sites in the net to answer your question.

This site explains Brihad jataka rules:-
http://chiraan.wordpress.com/2010/10/10/pravrajya-yoga/

This site explains sanyasa yoga from various angles:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanyasa_yoga

In today's world, we don't come across the classifications of sanyasis that texts speak of in the context of Pravrajya yoga. The ideal combination must have Moon in Martian navamsa even though the sun+ 3 /4 planetary combination does not exist in Rasi. Paramacharya's horoscope can be cited as a good example of Pravrajya yoga.

In reality, the grouping of planets with or without asthang planets mar the bhava significance. I have come across quite a few horoscopes (including mine) where the grouping results in sanayasin mentality - and not exactly a sanyasin life - triggered by the experiences indicated by the bhava where the grouping takes place. In the horoscope you have cited, there is dharma karmadhipathi yoga (9th moon and 10th Sun in mutual opposition) though moon is a bhaadhak. How is his job prospect?

//On a different note, I have seen quite a few people scheduling cissections basing on the horoscope of the to-be-born baby. Is this allowed as per our Shastras? I know shastra recommends muhurtas for grabhadana, nisheka and even for surgeries. But, are we stretching this recommendation too far by timing cissections?//

In my opinion it is wrong to fix the time for Cesarian operation with the intention of making the birth time auspicious. In reality, it is not possible to fix a time which is good on all counts.

jayasree said...

Reply to Mr Balaraman’s comment:

//One point I thought off while reading about Vishwamitra becoming a brahmin being an exception is this: In your tamil dravidana series you had mentioned that not all brahmins could become vedic scholars and carry out the 6 primary duties assigned to them - studying & teaching vedas, performing yagnas, getting them done, seeking alms and giving donations ---------Just for arguments sake can non brahmins today try the second set of 6 duties diligently and become brahmins over a period of time since as per Mr.Ramanathan the first set is impossible for them?//

The 3+3 types of teaching and learning did not make the Brahmins, Brahmins. They did these in addition to the other 5 duties assigned to them. Brahmins were / are entitled to all the 6 duties not just teaching. Please refer my article in the Tamil blog .

(from my Tamil blog)
இந்தப் பார்ப்பனர்களுக்கான தொழில்கள் ஆறு.
அவை
ஓதல், (கற்றல்)
ஓதுவித்தல், (கற்பித்தல்)
வேட்டல் (வேள்விகள் செய்தல்)
வேட்பித்தல் (வேள்விகள் செய்து வைத்தல்)
ஈதல் (தானம் கொடுத்தல்)
ஏற்றல் (தானம் பெற்றுக் கொள்ளுதல்)

இந்த ஆறு தொழில்களில் ’ஓதல்’ ஓதுவித்தல்’ என்று சொல்லப்பட்டுள்ளதே,
எதை ஓதினார்கள், எதை ஓதுவித்தார்கள்
என்று பார்க்கும் போது அதில் ஆறு வகை வருகிறது.
அந்த ஆறு வகைகள்
தலை, இடை, கடை என்று மூன்றாகப் பிரியும்.
அவை சமஸ்க்ருத்த்தில் தலை, இடை, கடை எனவும்,
தமிழில் தலை, இடை, கடை எனவும் ஆகும்.
இந்த் ஆறு வகைகளைக் குறித்து நச்சினார்க்கினியர் தரும் விளக்கத்தைக் காண்போம். (end quote)

For the sake of non Tamil readers let me explain this part. Generally we think that there are 4 varnas enunciated by Manu. But Tamil Grammar work Tholkappiyam classified people into 7 categories as 4 varnas + sanyasi + astrologers + Porunar (who were Kshatriya vratyas engaged in dancing and singing but could rise up at anytime with vigour to fight with sword and shoulders (wrestling)).

In this context Tholkkaapiyam continues to say that Brahmins were classified into 6 categories depending on what they taught – namely Primary, medium and secondary texts of Sanskrit and Tamil.

In Sanskrit, primary learning / teaching is Vedas, medium is vedangas and secondary is ithihasas, puranas. In tamil, primary learning / teaching is tamil grammar, medium is compositions of 2nd sangam period and secondary is compositions of the 3rd sangam period. This is a general list but includes other topics also, of Hinduism and dharma sastras.

This classification is a significant one as it shows that Sanskrit and Tamil thrived together in tamil lands. No other region of India or no other language of India thrived like this hand in glove. This commentary by Nacchinarkiniyar was written 1000 years ago and therefore we can vouchsafe for its root in an older past.

Mr Balaraman asks if others who teach these subjects be considered as Brahmins.
The answer is that this question is irrelevant. The teaching part is just one among the6 jobs that Brahmins were assigned to do. Today there are many people who teach the Tamil part of this classification. But why should they claim themselves as Brahmins?
Brahmins took part in other duties also – say, in yajnas and pitru ceremonies even if they could not officiate a yajna. Even today, a daana (donation) as a parihara is given to a Brahmin. By accepting that donation he is taking up the sin of the giver. Are others ready to do that? A Brahmin by his austerities and mantra japa, is capable of removing the sins accumulated form others. The mindset about Brahmins had been created without knowing the intricacies of these issues. Today people are just blaming or finding fault with the Brahmins. Life of a Brahmin is not easy, nor a bed of roses, nor even a position to be gloated. Some how the DK propaganda had poisoned the minds of the people.

Until they did this, people were as they were. There was no competition or comparison between Brahmins and others or among different castes themselves. Where is the need to compare? Everyone have their own life styles and actions. Why ape for others? Why ape to be a Brahmin?
(cont’d)

jayasree said...

Mr Balaraman said

//I am asking this question after reading the view of Mr. Ramanathan that a person becomes a brahmin by birth only. This mere thought is enough to make the dravidavadis to castigate the brahmins without them trying to understand the basis of karma, rebirth etc. //

Mr Ramanathan has given a good explanation for this:-
(quote Mr Ramanathan:- As for convincing dravida vaadis or anybody else, scientists or otherwise, i would not bother to do it. Not everybody gets to understand everything. The depth of ones dharmic life does not depend on the acceptance and refusal of anybody but on ones own conscience and faith. There are many people living such a dharmic life as per the Vedas and Shastras. They should be the example for anybody who would want to sincerely lead a dharmic life.”)

Mr Balaraman said:-

//In the other hand it is really hard for learned brahmins to convince others about karma, reborn as a brahmin on the basis of doing service to god in the last birth etc.

In today's scientific world such thoughts are hard to pass muster, in whichever way you may try to convince others by giving reference to astrological readings such as virinji yogam etc.//

I am not trying to convince people. I say what is there. This karmic explanation is the very basic of rebirth theory and why we suffer or why we are happy. People who are evolved with the mindset would get it. All these explanations are there at all times, from Gita to any acharya’s teachings. I write it here for the people who seek this knowledge through internet.

(cont'd)

jayasree said...

Mr Balaraman said:-

//Management guru Peter Drucker had said in his book "Effective Executive" that anything complicated will make management very difficult. This is because the common people have limited capabilities as compared to the experts and hence all the management rules have to be made very simple so as to make them understand them so that they can carry out the duties easily.

Hence top managers have to work very hard to make things simple to achieve good management in any institution whether it is a business entity or government or society itself.

Our vedic dharma principles are so complicated that one can understand why it is so difficult to manage with conflicts developing everywhere.//

I think it is Arindham Chaudhry who said that Krishna is the best management Guru. Krishna has already said the simple tools of management of karmic bondage. We, the mortals have nothing to do about it or change it or showcase it in new avatars. Simple remedy is surrender and be detached from the results. May be , for management theories on this, one can refer to Arindham and others who have written the same on Krishna.

Mr Balaraman said:-
//To their credit our rishis and munis had made the rules in such a way that the common people had only to follow the various rituals as told to them by the learned brahmins to lead a dharmic life. But educated persons dismiss such "rituals" easily since they want proof in everything. They also resent being over lorded by brahmins.//

I think I am precisely trying to do that – giving justification to these things in the ways known to people of my generation. On being 'lorded by Brahmins' , that is a propaganda. Hope readers read Mr Malar mannan's article I quoted in an above comment.

Mr Balaraman said:-
//The Manu dharma or the chaturvarna principles were clearly the excellent management tools of our ancient "management gurus" namely our rishis and munis! But due to the passage of several centuries the system has been corrupted enormously, so our present day vedic gurus will have to find a way to make the common people understand our dharma and live by its principles in today's world. Is it possible?//

I consider varnas as tools of human resource development, and nothing more. The entire society with people of different capabilities and expertise contributed to the society in which they thrived together by mutual inter-dependence.

Mr Balaraman said:-
//In a lighter vein I can understand one point in his writing: brahmins have been assigned so strict a regimen as to make them ignore sensual pleasures. This is the only area where we brahmins of today are really brahmins, meaning we keep totally silent whenever we are insulted or ridiculed by tamil film makers not giving vent to anger!//

The reason for their nature of lying low can be attributed o their sattwic nature and a realisation that any reaction would invite counter action (karmic return) and everything is Bhagawan’s sankalp.

jayasree said...

Dear Ms Kadambari.

I beg to differ from you.

You said //I believe that all new age religions including Buddhism had come up in order to reach the common masses to "Keep it Simple". //

Buddhism as known today is not considered as part of or an extension of Vedic thought, though Buddha was considered as an avatar of Vishnu. There was a historical bungling of Buddha's stature, when his followers 'created Buddhism'. What we know as Buddhism does not contain the original teachings of Buddha. You would find my other articles showing Buddha's meditative posture in Indus figurines. Such yogic life was part of Pasupathi kshetram which came to be known as Varana vadham or Varanasi or Kasi. Buddha was a yogi or an enlightened soul. Hindus venerated him for nearly 700 to 800 years before a sect was created in his name - with views that were not based on Vedic thought. Even then people continued to venerate Bauddha bhikshus. It was not because they taught on how to keep simple, but because it was a habit to venerate sadhus and saintly people.

*****

//Unfortunately the Science that was hidden in the Hindu religion ended up being too complicated for the common people. The upkeepers of the religion (read Brahmins) lost the significance and possibly the will to fight it out and retain / spread the knowledge.
Very few acharyas are able to transcend the resentment and ignorance and reach the masses. //

Hinduism is the religion for individuals, meaning, each one himself with God. It is a personal religion which can be realized by personal experience. 90% of what we see around us as Hindu practices are preliminary and preparatory tools only. At one stage the gyana marga would occur and the person starts to connect with his In dweller God.

In this set up Brahmins are not up-keepers of this religion,. They are only custodians of Vedas. But everyone else including saints, rishis and common men are the custodians of this religion. Every one has a right and access to growth of the Self through means of Hindu ideals. In this set up, Acharyas are doing their assigned duties. I dont agree with blaming them for whatever reason. It is for the individual to upkeep this tradition of acharyas and rise up inwardly.

Kadambari said...

Dear Madam,

With due apologies for my ignorance

"What we know as Buddhism does not contain the original teachings of Buddha" - I was under the assumption that Buddha became the enlightened one, and attempted to bring to focus to mankind, on what is essential for man to end this cycle of birth and death. Again - my assumption was that he tried to simplify the complexities for the common man.

If you do have a write-up on his actual teachings, I would be interested. I did a search in your blog, and found only 3 links, but not on this topic.

Regarding the other point - yes the religion is meant for all, and it is upto us to realize the significance.

However regarding "custody of Vedas" - does that require the person to be a Brahmin by birth?

Badari Narayanan V T said...

Society where all are engaged only in piety will be a non-functional society. Buddhism required everyone to live in a certain way, its decline is attributed to this. By the above reasoning, I see caste system as only vocation based. By specifying a rigid code for teachers and bhakti (simpler means such as naama sankeertanam) for others, Hinduism survived. Teachers with high ideals and hereditary training in vocation sustained the society. The focus was on living harmoniously by acquiring necessities and not on competition or unsustainable and insatiable consumerism of today's world. Ossification of the social setup with people focusing only on following their vocation and not bothering about taking up the duties prescribed for other varnas can be thus justified!

Not teaching Veda to women can be rationalized as a compromise between propagating knowledge and keeping the cooking fires at home going. Caste and gender based discrimination is thus not the inherent feature of Hinduism and was a result of later degeneration only.

On the social front, India's focus has been to sustain the family unlike the focus on the individual in the West. In matters of faith, the piety of the individual counted in Hinduism as against praying as a group in the Abrahamic religions. Diversity was forcefully put down in the West due to their monotheistic beliefs. Thus Indian practices were diametrically opposite on all fronts and could not be understood by them.

As I understand Hinduism, there is no requirement to reach the higher varna in subsequent births to ultimately attain salvation. Bhakthi to God, dedication to one's duties, serving parents and society with sincerity etc exalts the soul and in this birth itself and in this varna / jaati (what ever it might be) itself one attains salvation. Higher caste or scholarship or gender is never a criterion or obstacle for realizing God. This I believe is the essence of Hinduism

jayasree said...

Dear Ms Kadambari

Buddha was considered as the 9th avatar by Hindus. He lived 1000 years before the currently held notion of 6the century BC. Fa hien's records give a different picture of Buddha. The following link gives info as recorded in the Journal of Asiatic society that all Hindus - including Brahmins venerated Buddha.

http://books.google.co.in/books?id=umZEfH1n0X4C&pg=PA444&lpg=PA444&dq=Parasurama+in+Asiatic+Society&source=bl&ots=XbaHTg7Vvc&sig=lel9tHTbg0mhgDFfeiGlvYFuvPw&hl=en&sa=X&ei=KTCqT9zZOIzjrAfM-OjiAQ&sqi=2&ved=0CEsQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q&f=false

In Page 247 you would find inscription evidence of Chandra gupta’s donation of land to Buddhists. It is written that the one who robs that would incur 5 times the sin of murdering a Brahmin. Why bring in a Brahmin here unless it was about a Vedic society?

In page 286 of the above link you would come across the description of India as following non violence and ahimsa - the so-called Buddhist Thought as a way of life of India even before such a Thought came into existence in the 6th century BC by organized Buddhist religion.

In the same page you would find the mention of Buddha having died of dysentery after eating pork! The source of this information is attributed to Mahawanso & Suttapikika!!!

There were many Buddhas in India. Sibi, the progenitor of Cholas was adopted as a Buddha in Buddhist tradiiton. You would find a place called Sibi in Pakistan even today (near which Brahui -having resemblance to Tamil is spoken). Next to that is a place called Cholistan ! Perhaps the origin of Cholavarman who came all the way from there to Tamil lands to establish Chola dynastry! This is different topic. Let me come back the original topic.

(cont'd)

jayasree said...

From my earlier comment under the article
http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2012/07/dark-matter-is-7th-wind-of-seven-wind.html

Hinduism pre-existed Buddhism. Infact Buddha was born around 1000 BC and not on the date that present day historians had projected. He was considered as the avatar of Vishnu, He was Siddhartha Buddha born in Ikshvaku dynasty. His birth was prophesied even in Mahabharatha. Hindus revered him and kings glorified him. There are enough chronicles to prove that.

The following are the dates of Buddha as recorded in the Asiatic society's Oriental Magazine in 1825.

# According to Padmakarpo, Lama of Bhutan written in 16th century – Buddha’s birth was in1058 BC

# Kalhana – 1332 BC

# Abul Fazl- 1366 BC

# Couplet form Chinese historians – 1036 BC

# Researches by De Guigne 1027 BC

# Giorgi –death of Buddha 959 BC

# Bailly -1031 BC (birth)

# William Jones 1027 BC

# Bentley 1081 or 1004 BC

# Jaehrig from Mongol chronology published by Pallas 991 BC

# Japanese Encyclopedia birth 1027 BC
Death 960 BC

# Matouan –in Chinese historian of 12th cen - 1027 BC

# M. Klaproth quoting from Chinese source = 1027 BC

All this information that the British collected had an unsettling effect on them because it far preceded the Christian origin. It alone offered a strong proof to destroy the Biblical date of creation.

The colonial writers could dismiss Mahabharatha which established the antiquity of India very easily - on the pretext that it was not a historical document. But they could not dismiss the antiquity of Buddha because the proofs came from across a spectrum - from outside India also.

The result was that they chose the Buddha (many Budhdas were born)of the 6th century BC as the first Buddha and rewrote the past of our culture.

The animosity against Buddhism started only after a group of disciples started to develop a literature saying that it contained the teachings of Buddha whereas, Buddha was not known have mouthed such teachings. The literature developed by Buddhists around 6th century BC was an anathema to Vedic literature and this resulted in Hindus disowning Buddha as an avatar of Vishnu.

This literature was spread by Buddhists to such an extent that there was danger to Vedic culture of getting forgotten. In that situation Adhi Shankra emerged to set right the confusion and he re- established Vedic culture.

The same happened with Jainsim. Infact we get see the iconographic description for Buddha (Shakya muni) and Mahaveera (Arhant) along with other deities of Hindu pantheon in Varahamihira's Brihad Samhitha and Mayamatha - showing that these two saints followed Hindu path only. But it is the later day disciples of them who deviated from the original path of these two and created a different set of system and started to spread that system.

Naturally that had to be resisted. Such resistance took place in Tamil lands also showing that the roots of our culture were in Hinduism and not in Buddhism or Jainism. With the rise of Buddhist literature - developed not by Buddha but by his followers who wrote what Buddha did not say - Hindus gradually stopped considering Buddha as the 9th avatar of Vishnu. This is the background history.

jayasree said...

Mr Badri Narayan wrote
//As I understand Hinduism, there is no requirement to reach the higher varna in subsequent births to ultimately attain salvation. Bhakthi to God, dedication to one's duties, serving parents and society with sincerity etc exalts the soul and in this birth itself and in this varna / jaati (what ever it might be) itself one attains salvation. Higher caste or scholarship or gender is never a criterion or obstacle for realizing God. This I believe is the essence of Hinduism //

Very true. This is my understanding also.

To add a qualification to this. "Yogah karmasu kaushalam" of Gita. It means dexterity in action. Whatever you do, do with utmost commitment and concentration without attaching any like or dislike or rewards or expectations from that. In this context let me quote the examples I wrote earlier in this section - of a 4th varna person preparing the yaaga shaala with utmost dedication would be born as a Veda-vitthu in his next birth and attain moksha.

jayasree said...

Ms Kadambari wrote

//
However regarding "custody of Vedas" - does that require the person to be a Brahmin by birth?//

Yes. May be do a re-reading of the above article by Mr Ramanathan. In addition, watch these videos by D.A Joseph where he describes the nuances expected of a Brahmin to be able to study Vedas. There are 5 parts in that series which actually deal with the question of Aryan invasion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lVz8sqcxGw&feature=related

Also read Dharampal's Beautiful containing the educational records of the colonial era from which it is known that Brahmins who practiced celibacy were allowed to undertake Vedic learning. From among others only those who exhibited certain behavioral tendencies were allowed to study Philosophy.

Purity of birth helped in developing certain qualities. You would find such a line up for 14 generations. That is, if certain standards are maintained for 14 generations continuously, the one born in the 15th generation would be the culmination of those qualities. You would find that in Rama's birth. There is an article on this in my blog.

narayana said...

Thank you very much, Smt. Jayasree.

With regards to your comment below,

//In the horoscope you have cited, there is dharma karmadhipathi yoga (9th moon and 10th Sun in mutual opposition) though moon is a bhaadhak. How is his job prospect?//

The native is an Ivy-league graduate with very impressive academic accomplishments but has trouble finding a job commensurate with his educational qualifications. He is gainfully employed but always feels severely short changed when it comes to compensation and job satisfaction. He is looking for advice on how his situation can be improved. Any help and counsel you can provide will be very helpful.

Is there another forum/venue to discuss this in more detail with your permission? I don't want to side track the discussion going on here.

Unknown said...

One more point is that i consider Buddhism and Jainism responsible for encouraging the practice misplaced non violence especially among kings. It converted Kshatriya kings into non-violent people. Thus letting down the people who believed in their protection. The Vedas say that the kings have to fight dharmic wars. There was a code of honour followed, like non killing of non-combatants, women children, solders who lost their arms and ammunition and so on. I believe this to be one of the causes for major foreign invasion of India and slide of dharma. The strong protective arm of the Kshatriya is needed for other Varnas to perform their duties and thus for peace and progress.

But because of the lop sided emphasis on non-violence by buddhism and Jainism, invaders like Alexander etc were emboldened thus further weakening India for future invaders. Moreover they are purely monastic religions and can be equated as the advanced sanyasa ashrama of hinduism. There is no "Rasa" in it for people who cannot be sanyasis. Sanatana dharma does not restrict attainment of mukti to one Varna or Ashrama alone, though the sanyasa ashrama is intended for people who really have true vairagya for wordly stuff. This is just to free really qualified souls from humdrum routine and provide them a way for easy attainment of mukti.


Sanyasa is not every bodies cup of tea and i feel this is one of the reasons for decline of buddhism and jainism

Ramanathan

jayasree said...

Thanks Mr Ramanathan. Valid points.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Narayana,
Please leave your e mail ID in the comment section along with the birth details of the person. I will write to you tomorrow.

jayasree said...


From: Balaraman S

Dear Jayasree Mam,

I stand corrected for my comments on the secondary set of 6 duties of brahmins. I wrote those remarks from my memory only without re-reading the section before making my comments. In a way I have proved Peter Drucker's view that as a common man I have limited ability (not being able to retain what I had read in the past and quoting it properly!).

From Mr.Ramanathan's comment on Buddhism and Jainism taking up ahimsa totally with the result that the kshatriyas were made ahimsawadis also thus losing their kshatriya dharma of defending their kingdoms, it becomes clear as to why India suffered such massive invasions and lost her glory during those centuries. This had always remained a puzzle for me all these years. I thank Mr.Ramanathan to given as insight to the matter.

Bala

Sheela said...

Dear Madam,

Thanks for thought provoking post & comments which will lead us only for good.

"irrespective of what the likes of Karunanidhi and Kamal Hassans say, if the Brahmins maintained their way of living, people would always respect"

i go with this opinion strongly. Austerities command respect., especially young girls with access to different sections of society should not sway from their core values & culture.

all new aged religions are like lakes & ponds when compared to sanatana dharma which is a mighty ocean. Simple boats are enough for lakes & ponds.

I believe that everything prescribed in Vedas and by Acharyas have scientific meaning and instead of doubting or searching for proofs if we follow with faith they will lead us safely to cross journey of life.

Sheela

pratap ar said...

I would not completly agree with the assertion that non violence propagated led to foreign invasions.The primary desturction of hindu culture and population has been done by Islam and Christains in the last 1000 years,not so much the greeks.In fact Alexander was not able to advance beyond the Ganges.Looking at history,it would be more due to lack of political and religious unity among the hindus and even the Kshatriya dharma among the Hindus.Prthviraj defeated Ghazuni many times but allowed him to escape.In return the fanatic came back and killed ,tortured prithviraj and mascarred non combatants ,women etc.This was the case generally with all Islamic marauders.However the hindu resurgence was led by spirutual gurus like Sri Vidyaranya and Samartha Ramdas who inspired the Vijayanagara Kings and Shivaji.Sanatana Dharma cannot be killed,it is eternal though with the advent of Kali it has withered in influence and efficacy.It can be found that our dharma complete ahimsa is prescibed only for the paramahamsa sanyasin,not for others.It can also be found that budhist countries and bhikshus have the highest meat eating population and ahimsa is hardly practiced in reality.Paramacharya's discourse on ahimsa

http://kamakoti.org/hindudharma/part22/chap2.htm

pratap ar said...

wrt marriage in brahmins the points I wanted to highlight was

1)The deterioration of culture significanlty among young women of the brahmin caste,alteast the middle and upper class.A hip hop materialized culture is preffered with the result that whatever little of the rituals and tradition we follow is in danger of not being passed on to the next generation.

2.As a corollary of this intercaste marriages are high among Brahmin women which along with a Shrinking of numbers has resulted in a great demand for them.

Skandan said...

Respected madam,

reg HYD blast and innocent people getting killed.

in one of your earlier comments section ( may be a year ago)you did gave some solution on how to get us protected by these incidents - like chanting mrutunjaya mantra etc..

we need to accept the fact that these kind of bomb blasts are going to continue for some more time till there is a attitude change among people and rulers. Till then as a common man, what is that we can do "to be safe...."

I read in todays hindustan times paper that those who were standing on the road were saved. those who were sitting inside the road shleter and waiting for bus got killed. few feet difference changed the whole family's fate.

I came to know that One of my friend's family in HYD, planned to go Dilsukh market that day evening and started around 6.30 and suddently changed plan to go to a different market. they had divine blessing i guess.

pranams
Skandan

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Skandan,

Another reader has expressed similar view that she had a miraculous escape from the Hyd blast, as she was supposed to be in the location at the time of blast. The comment can be read here:


http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2009/03/birth-of-baby-in-star-of-parent.html?showComment=1361586610260#c3799252050146651051

Its TIME that works or not works for anyone. This was the thought that came to my mind when the meteor hot Russia last week. Thought of writing a blog on that and somehow it is getting delayed.

Mruthyunjana japa, Sudharshana Gayathri can be recited everyday to avert untimely and accidental death. Rudrabhsishekam is also to be done in the shrines for averting misfortunes in a place.

Sowmya said...

Thanks Jayasree Madam for such enlightening articles & useful suggestions like this

-----------------------------------
Mruthyunjana japa, Sudharshana Gayathri can be recited everyday to avert untimely and accidental death. Rudrabhsishekam is also to be done in the shrines for averting misfortunes in a place.
-----------------------------------

Bu Rudrabhishekam ,you arereferring to Ekadasha Rudra homam(the elaborate one with 11 pundits,11 rounds of chanting ,homam ,abhishek,aahuti) or just one round abhihek with dravyas & Rudra chanting ?

Thanks
Sowmya

vamsi kakumanu said...

Hi-- I would like to know your commments on Alexander and Porus War..

jayasree said...

Dear Ms Sowmya,

By Rudrabhishekam as a remedy, it is meant regular abhishekam in Shiva shrines. The Pradosha puja and prescribed pujas for Shiva in dancing posture protect the community from enemies and ensures the destruction of the enemy. This abhisheka is done for the community in the temples. For individuals, keeping up Pradosha vratha and worshiping Lord Shiva at Pradosha kaala puja in temple is given as a remedy. For Jupiter dasa - Jupiter Bhukthi, the Rudrabhishekam as told by you can be done as one time remedy.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Vamsi,

I have written an article on whether Alexander did indeed defeat Porus in my blog:-

http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2008/07/did-alexander-defeat-porus.html

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Vamsi,
I have posted a couple of comments in the Alexander vs Porus article of the above quoted link. Skanda - Scadinavia connection and Alaksandu root of Alexander are written there. Please read.

jayasree said...

Dear Mr Pratap,

Did the ahimsa preaching of Buddha / Jaina make us incapable of fighting? This question may need a wider debate but at the moment I came across an article in Manasa Tarangini that highlights Arjuna's arguments in favour of Himsa for existence of life. Food for thought!

The link is

http://manasataramgini.wordpress.com/2013/03/05/the-lesson-of-arjuna/

Inquiring Mind said...

@jayasree,

What you said is applicable only for ordinary vaideeha brahmins..

But the anti-Brahminism was because of those dubashi brahmins who worked for Colonial British Government, and posted across india.. It is they who wielded the beurocratic power, and became the front end of british atrocities..

Pls read my blog on the same..

http://psenthilraja.wordpress.com/2012/12/05/dubashi-brahmins-and-vaidiha-brahmins/

http://psenthilraja.wordpress.com/2012/12/17/can-english-educated-brahmins-be-dharmic/


I have asked about this with many of the elders in my community.. all of them pointed to illtreatment by brahmin lawyers and none of them accused the brahmin archagas or purohits..


So the urban brahmins should be honest enough to accept this truth, NOT for blaming game, but to find a solution ..

In my analysis, the retaining of brahmin identity by those left vaideeha dharma and adopted corporate and government jobs, had been the single most disaster for our entire dharma.. This set a wrong precedent for all castes, that one's caste is decided by birth alone..

Wheras earlier, a person should be born in the jathi and also follow the jathi dharma.. if he violates jathi dharma, he is kicked out..

(ps refer smarthavicharam happened in travancore samasthanam, where more than 100 nairs and namboodris were outcasted for immorality)..

What is the solution today?
-----------------------------

All those urban brahmins should discard their brahmin identity, and adopt a new jathi identity.. the brahmin identity should be reserved only for those who follow traditional brahmana dharma and live simple brahminic life..

And there should be NO matrimonial relation b/w these non-vaideeha ex-brahmins and those vaideeha brahmins..

Pls let me know your feedback..

jayasree said...


@ Inquiring Mind.

You have asked for my feedback.
I read your articles, your deductions and the comments. My feedback is that– you have not done your homework well.

My comment is that – From Pitti Thyagaraja to Senthil Raja, Brahmin Bashing has taken different avatars – from abusing the Brahmin for being a Vaideeka, to abusing him for not being a Vaideeka! Ultimately the British agenda against Brahmins is going on unabatedly till today. Your comment reveals that you have articulated a prejudice fed by personal experiences of some in your community but not supported by data or facts.

// I have asked about this with many of the elders in my community.. all of them pointed to illtreatment by brahmin lawyers and none of them accused the brahmin archagas or purohits..//


The first part of the above comment is a personal experience but the latter part of the comment was not the way how Brahmins were viewed for about a century.
Coming to the first part, it seems to be influenced by the anti-Brahmin propaganda of that time in Madras. Throughout India, the Brahmin lawyers were in the forefront of the Independence Movement. The attack on Brahmin lawyers was a sort of natural corollary to the anti-Brahmin movement, because these people (of Anti- Brahmin movement) were supporters of the British. Combining pro-British stance and anti-Brahmin sentiment, people like Annadurai and Neduncheziyan had abused Brahmin lawyers in many public meetings. As a drip-down effect, prejudiced notions against Brahmin lawyers had spread among the people.

If we look at the number of persons who graduated in law, it would show the state of things. In the then Madras Presidency (Tamilnadu + Kerala + Andhra + Karnataka + Orissa) the total number of candidates who appeared for Law exam in 1891 was 130. Out of it only 40 people passed out. 610 persons appeared for Law in 1901 out of which only 300 passed out. There is no data on the caste split-up of these figures. But such a meagre number spread out in a vast Presidency raises a question on how many Brahmins among them were powerful and went unpunished for ill-treatment of others. If someone has a grievance, that must have been localised, and it is not right to blame a community for the misbehavior of some. Such kind of people will be there in any community.

(continued)

jayasree said...

The second part of your comment says that the Brahmin archagas and Purohitas did not ill treat them!! What a Pramana patram is this! Couldn’t they tell this to others at that time?


The main impetus to Brahmin hatred stemmed from an incident involving a Vaideeka Brahmin and Pitti Thyagaraja. Pitti Thyagaraja was in a top position in Madras Corporation. He donated a good amount for the Kumbhabhishekam of Kapaleesvara temple in Mylapore and was sitting in the front row during the rituals. A Brahmin who was working under him was standing near the deity as part of Veda recital Goshti. His high position in govt did not give him access to be near the deity whereas a low level servant under him was able to go near the deity due to him being a Vaideeka Brahmin! This infuriated Pitti Thyagaraja and made him align with the non-Brahmin movement which did not gain popularity until then. He eventually gave shape to the movement as a party. This happened in 1920s. The abuse of Brahmins for being a Vaideeka had come to a circle within a century, and now he is abused for not being a Vaideeka. In the intervening century, what do people know about how these Brahmins lived? Who was responsible for killing Vaideekam from their lives?


You and your elders make a distinction between ‘Brahmin’ archagas and ‘Brahmin’ lawyers. But at that time, anti-Brahmin-wallahs did not make any distinction between them. Anyone who had a PooNul and Kudumi was attacked or abused. Every Brahmin had these two – even the so-called Dubhashi Brahmins and Brahmin lawyers sported the poonul. The high pitched slogan targeted all Brahmins.

"பார்ப்பனர்களையும் பாம்பையும் கண்டால் பாம்பை விட்டு விட்டுப் பார்ப்பனரை அடி. உச்சிக் குடுமியை வெட்டு; பூணூலை அறு: நாமத்தை அழி"

Can you show a single incident of a Dubhashi Brahmin or archaga Brahmin to have retaliated them or abused them? If the Dubhashi Brahmins and lawyer Brahmins were so powerful or close to British power centre, why didn’t they do anything to shut their mouths? That they didn’t do shows the lack of clout they had. It also shows that they were Brahmins by attitude – being sacred and not attacking others even for self defence.
Periyar who spread venom against Brahmins rented his houses to Brahmins only with an assertion that only Brahmins would not default on payment of rent. Such honesty is the hall mark of a Brahmin that even today from colleges to ordinary provision shops, they employ Brahmins in accounts and finance section. From birth, a Brahmin is taught karma theory (even in crude terms like “don’t do this, swamy kannai kuththidum” – you will be punished by God) and the need for not increasing his karma. People of other castes are also honest but this kind of preaching from birth does not happen to all except Brahmins.

(continued)


jayasree said...

Let me look at other part of your comment.

// But the anti-Brahminism was because of those dubashi brahmins who worked for Colonial British Government, and posted across india.. It is they who wielded the beurocratic power, and became the front end of british atrocities..//

First of all anti-Brahmanism was seen only in Tamilnadu part of the then Madras Presidency and nowhere else in India. Brahmins are hated only in Tamilnadu and not anywhere else in India. The 1901 census minces no words when it says that Brahmins were NOT in the lead in education all places of India. (page 166, Chapter V- Education) . It says “The most noticeable feature of the return is that everywhere the professional and trading class take the lead.” But the Brahmins were not always in the lead. In Dubhashi scenario, the data furnished in 1901 census of the number of people who studied English is as follows: I am giving the data for those provinces where the number is higher among the provinces.
Number per 10,000 literate in English as per 1901 census.

In Assam:-
Kayastha - 493
Brahmins – 330

In Bengal:-
Baidya – 1585
Kayastha – 673
Brahmins - 358

In Bombay Presidency :-
Native Christians – 2472
Prabhu – 1566
Brahmins – 529

In Madras Presidency :-
Eurasian – 7045
Brahmin – 975
Native Christian – 272
Kamala -11
Shanan – 5
Mappilla – 5
Mala -1

The census report on Madras covers Parayan, Madiga and Cheruman also but not other communities. Please note this number covers the entire Presidency. There was no data taken on Mudaliars and Chettiars and all those govt servants, other employees and English speaking ones of the anti Brahmin movement. A reading of the Report gives a false opinion that these other castes are nowhere in the reckoning but the fact is that they had a presence everywhere, but not enumerated in the Report. This impression has been exploited by the anti-Brahmin leaders who poisoned the minds of the people that Brahmins were bad. The hidden agenda of the leaders of this movement – something brought out in the write-ups of Ma. Venkatesan, Ka. Subbu, Jepamani and K.V. Lakshmi Narayanan – is that they successfully thrashed competition from the Brahmins and stalled any progress of the SC & ST.

A kind of obsession with Brahmins can be seen in all the Census reports of the British period. There is a general tendency to quote Manu wherever possible and look at Indians through Manu sastra. Eg:- Why all Brahmins are not priests? Why no one called himself as a Shudra? The census planners were interested in knowing about the so-called highly advanced and the so-called highly degraded castes of Manuvadi system. This played a part in making people think that Brahmins appropriated all opportunities, ill-treated others and dictated terms on others, while in reality the landlords and trading class exploited and continue to exploit this mis conception. I have explained all these in 10 parts so far starting from this part:-

http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2012/03/were-brahmins-bad-sequel-to.html

I have stopped at the place where I have to explain how the varna system was shattered for the first time in known history by the acts of Parasurama. That required some more study on some castes of North India which I am slowly doing now. I would continue that series after some time.

(continued)

jayasree said...

Here I coming to your core obsession on why not all Brahmins are in vaideeka and why should others who are not in Vaideeka be called as Brahmins.

Take a look at Parasurama. He was a Brahmin but behaved like a Kshatriya and did what even a kshatriya would find difficult to do. By your parameters, Parasurama cannot be called as a Brahmin. Can such a deduction be right?

No, says scriptures. Here I am referring to Shanthi parva of Mahabharata and Parasara Smrithi, the smrithi text for Kali yuga.
In any situation the kshatriyas have to do their job well, only then the country and the people can survive. Manu was asked to lead the people only on this pretext. When the kshatriya fails to protect the people and go against the people, anyone of the other varnas can take arms to protect and reinstall a proper government. This is called Apath-dharma (ஆபத் தர்மம்).

Parasurama did that. He vanquished Kartha veeryarjuna who killed an innocent Brahmin over the possession of a cow. As a king he must protect the Brahmin and also not take away the cow forcibly. Parasurama retaliated for that. He decided to kill all the kings in the vicinity as a kind of sterilising the land of the greedy and unjust kshatriyas. After ding that he established kings from Brahmin community! What would you call those Brahmins? as Brahmins or Kshatriyas? So the first deviation away from core vaideeka was initiated by none other than Parasurama, an avatar of Vishnu! It was because the Yuga dharma had changed and perfect societal conditions did not exist to support Brahmins to be engaged only in Vaideeka karmas. I think you would have got part of the answer here.

When the society is not conducive, the Brahmin cannot discharge his duties 100 percent. It is not vice versa as you think. It is not because Brahmins left their vaideekam, others also left their duties. You would have read in the Pura nanuru verse of Mudu kudumi Peruvazhuthi that Brahmins, women, children, old people, cows and those who tend the cow and those who have not yet begotten male children were protected from any violence or effect of a war or any kind of turmoil. The Brahmin haters would be seething with anger for why the Brahmins were included in this list. Even a single Brahmin who carried the torch of Vedic yajnas can save a country from destruction. None of the items mentioned in the Pura nanuru verse are protected today.
Going from the present to past, even around the turn of last century, the rural communities were intact with all the castes inter dependent on each other and therefore self sufficient. The cities also were mentioned as extended rural life structure in the 1901 census. Only a few cities that had more than a lakh people showed a difference from the rural social life.

The rural social life was such that Brahmins had interaction with everyone, and not just as archagas in the temple. Every household needed the services of a Brahmin from birth to death. There was no distinction between who called them for the service. The so-called Shudras ( no one gave their caste as Shudra – a thing that the British census enumerators lamented) had to call Brahmins for Pitru puja, Graha shanthi, marriage and death ceremony. Bheeshma says that atleast for Graha shanthi, a person had to call a Brahmin. From Mahabharatha, we come to know that if a person loses contact with Brahmins, he would become a shudra! Losing contact with Brahmins means not doing anything that requires a Brahmin to do (by mantras).

(continued)

jayasree said...

If we look at Morco Polo’s travelogue, even the Parathavas (fishermen community) used the service of Brahmins in pearl diving trips. A Brahmin would accompany them in the boat that takes them to the location where the divers would dive into the sea for taking pearls. Before that at an auspicious time, the Brahmin would do puja and cast some mantras on the waters so that the divers would not be troubled by the harmful creatures of the sea while they dived. This cast lasted only for the day time and therefore every day they dived, the Brahmin had to go along with them. Would you say that they were not Brahmins because they were not doing the temple duties?


Coming to the social life that I explained in the previous to the above paragraph, within a same village, some Brahmins were engaged in temple pujas, some in doing yajnas, some in doing ceremonies of sorts for different castes and so on. The census report ridicules that many Brahmins were doing just eating business!! Brahmins are needed in Shraddha (pitru) ceremonies for all castes. Yes, the Brahmins ate in the house of anyone who called them to take the offerings for the Pitrus in the pitru Puja! This is the status in 1901 as per the census report. But Brahmins were accused of being caste conscious and practicing untouchability!

Today how many non-Brahmins are doing shraddha ceremonies and feed Brahmins in those ceremonies? Ever since anti-Brahmin movement started, the other castes have completely left their practices, but you are blaming the Brahmins as not doing their duties.


The British were obsessed with this culture of Brahmins being part of every household. It is because every household consulted the Brahmins on every issue. The Brahmins were fed on all occasions. This increased the closeness with that the British found the Brahmins as an obstacle – perhaps in achieving their missionary works. So they threatened the people not to feed the Brahmins. In 1871, when Census people came to the collect data, people thought that they have come to collect a tax for having fed the Brahmins! A generation of people of India were given a message not to entertain any Brahmins. And the subsequent generations stopped taking services from the Brahmins. What would the Brahmin do when his traditional clients (!) moved away from them?

(continued)


jayasree said...

Go back in history by 1000 years. Then also Brahmins were engaged not just in Vaideekam but other activities, like cooking, recitals (alone) and teaching and giving commentaries on dharma sastras, Epics etc. They were engaged as ministers by kings. But they were all Brahmins and no one thought like you.


Go back in history by 2000 years. Varahamihira says that a Brahmin who is expert in astrology can be treated as a Vedic scholar and be given the first food of the shraddha ceremony!


Go back further in history, Madurai KAnchi, the Tamil Sangam texts speaks of Brahmins as doing Vedas and Yajna related things only.


But 2000 yrs BP, a change in the Yuga dharma seems to have come in place. A verse attributed to Kapilar of Sangam age, quoted by writer ‘Kalki’ in an editorial in Kalki of January 1954 gives an interesting information, The verse says

“வட திசைப் பார்ப்பான் தென் திசைக்கேகின்
நடையது கோணிப் புலையன் ஆவான்.
தென் திசைப் புலையன் வடதிசைக்கேகின்
பழுதற ஓதிப் பார்ப்பான் ஆவான்"

A Brahmin who comes from North India would be degraded in the South.

But a degraded person from the South, if he goes to North, he would become a Brahmin.

This verse supposedly written 2000 years ago tells the state of things for the Brahmins in the South, referring to Tamilnadu in this context. The societal environment was not conducive for a Brahmin to discharge his duties in Tamil lands even as early as 2000 years ago. The reasons can be traced to the non-acceptance of Idangai / Vamachara people who were popularly known as Pashanda people of 96 sects. This is a different thread which I will be taking up in Brahmins article and Thamizhan Dravidanaa series. Suffice it to say here that there exited a difference in worshiping methods between the people in Tamil lands and the people who came from – of all the places – the Indus!! They were following Vamachara whereas Tamil people were following Dakshinachara.


When they came to Tamil lands – normally they come as a complete group of the rural community, with their leaders (kings) Brahmins, cattle tenders, traders and utility makers like potter, barbers and even grave yard keepers! One section spread in the belt north of Tamil nadu in Dharmapuri, Krishnagiri, Hosur etc. Adhyaman came in their lineage.


Another group settled in Kanchipuram. There was a Pashanda Saatthan temple there mentioned in Silapapdhikaram. In the Kongu belt or western ghat region, a group was sent by Gauthami Putra Shatakarni as a gift to Cheran Senguttuvan (Silappadhikaram) asking him not to come to the Himalayas but instead that he would be given the necessary stones by Shatakarnis themselves. Friction started between the Idangai people and the existing people who followed Valangai Thought. The Idangai were Tantra followers which was not in vogue in Tamil lands then who were Mantra followers. This difference was there among Shiva worshipers. There are many literary and epigraphic evidences to this. Even Kapaleeswara temple was an Idangai temple.


The Idnagai were taxed and given step motherly treatment. But later Kulothunga Cholan supported them as he found an affinity with them due to his parentage from Western Chalukyas who were Idangai.


Why I am saying all these is that there was non-acceptance of Brahmins (and others) who came from North India. Perhaps this non acceptance of the Idangai Brahmins in the South was conveyed by Kapilar in that poem. All these show the difficulties in the environment – something commonly called as change of Yuga dharma.

(continued)

jayasree said...

When conditions are not conducive for the Brahmins to carry out the traditional duties, they are allowed to take up agriculture, There is a discourse on this by Bheeshma where he says that this topic had been discussed many times in the past by the sages. That means the Yuga dharma had vitiated many times in the past and the Brahmins had to continue to exist in newer situations.

Bheeshma says that on such occasions the Brahmins can take up weapons (kshatriya or political duties). They can trade things with the exception of trading the following things : liquor, salt, sesame, (eLLU) horse, cow, bull, non-veg and cooked food.


In the case of cooked food, the Brahmin can trade it in return for grains. In this context Bheeshma refers to the discussion in former times and says “யுதிஷ்டிர, இந்த விஷயத்தில் உலகத்தில் பிரவிர்த்திருத்த பெரியோர்களின் சனாதனமான தர்மத்தை உபதேசிக்கிறேன். அதனை நீ தெரிந்து கொள். 'நான் இதை உனக்குக் கொடுக்கிறேன். நீ இதை எனக்குக் கொடு' என்று பலாத்காரமின்றி, ப்ரீதியுடன் மாற்றிக் கொள்வது யுக்தமான தர்மம்தான். இப்படியே ரிஷிகளுக்கும், மற்றவர்களுக்கும் புராதன விவகாரங்கள் நடந்து வருகின்றன. இது நல்லது, சம்சயமில்லை" என்று பீஷ்மர் கூறினார்.” (1919 edition of the Tamil Translation of Mahabharata by Painga naadu Ganapathy Sastrigal)


A Brahmin can exchange something from him with another in the spirit of mutual agreement and by non-coercion for the sake of making a living. Parasara Smrithi also allows a Brahmin to do trading with the above mentioned exceptions. Both Bheeshma and Parasara say that a Brahmin can take up agriculture for a living. But in that case he must do Pancha yajnas as a Prayaschittha for the destruction of minute life forms in doing cultivation. (This is the reason why anna daanam ( as part of eegai) is recommended as a must for farmers – refer PuRap poruL VeNba maalai)


I am writing this for the sake of Brahmins who I know are worried whether they are violating their Kula-achara by doing different jobs. Majority of Tamil Brahmins have been forced out of their Kula dharma due to the century old hatred and vitiation of the environment. They can take up a job in the spirit of “ I am giving this (even intelligence) and getting money in return for running my livelihood.


Brahmins were never asked to discard money. They were offered money – gold coins in the many homas and ceremonies. Today the gold coins are replaced with 1 rupee coin! The concept of accepting money that was offered was not to deny them money but to remind them that they should not go after money. But when that practice is stopped, the Brahmins can look at other means to run their family.

In this context let me quote the KuRal, which says that if the Creator had ordained that one must live by begging / taking from others, then let the Creator Himself become one living like that.
இரந்தும் உயிர் வாழ்தல் வேண்டின் பரந்து
கெடுக உலகு இயற்றியான் (KuRaL – 1062)

The idea of giving to the Brahmin also comes as a kind of a means to get better worlds. Bheeshma gives a long list of persons who attained better worlds by gifting to the Brahmins.

There is one more KuRal which directly refers to the Brahmin. It says even if a Brahmin forgets Vedas, he must not deviate from his Kula achara. Otherwise his Kulam would suffer ignominy
. மறப்பினும் ஒத்துக் கொளலாகும், பார்ப்பான்
பிறப்பு ஒழுக்கம் குன்றக் கெடும் (Kural 134)


This shows that one need not be a Vaideeka Brahmin but continue to be a Brahmin by following the Kula achara. Such a person is called as a Brahmin only and not discarded.

By the description of Thiru-kuRaL and words of Bheesha and Parasara, they are BRAHMINS ONLY. They are not different from the Brahmins who are engaged in Purohitham or temple kainkaryam.


(continued)

jayasree said...

In the current age of Kali, of vitiated Dharma and fearful conditions for Brahmins, 3 things make Brahmin, a Brahmin. Samskaras, anushtanam (gayatri japa and any part of Tamil or Sanskrit Veda, vedantha, and personal discipline ) and attitude (donation, austerity, humility and non-violence according to Bheeshma). When conditions are suitable, start parayana and teach what you know. Majority of Tamil Brahmins including NRIs are doing these.


Lastly, there are many acharyas for the Brahmin families, They know well and guide well, Almost every Brahmin family is attached to some Guru and the connection continues. This connection makes them stick to samskaras which make them Brahmins (refer Mr Ramanathan’s replies) and follow dos and donts of personal discipline. Most of them who are working, and take up adhyayana of some parts of Tamil and Sanskrit scriptures while in jobs or after retirement. Their connection with the Guru continues. There is lot more on this part of Guru sambhandam written in Srivachana Bhooshanam. The gurus know better than you Mr Senthil on whether the present way of life makes them Brahmins or not. The Authority lies with them, and not with others.

(concluded)

smk said...

Jayashree thanks for the nice article by Ramanathan.Now i know the duties of a brahmana.
Could u post about the 42 samskaras in order of doing also could ask from him.

You may delete this comment after that.

Thanks
Murali.

R.Ramanathan said...

There are the 42 samskaras one has to do. Picked out from the website http://www.kandamangalam.com/Samskaras.aspx

01. Garbhadana
02. Pumsavanam
03. Seemantonnayana (Baby Shower)
04. Jatakarma
05. Namakarnam (Name Giving)
06. Nishkramana
07. Annaprashanam (First Solid Food)
08. Choulam (First Hair Cut)
09. Upanayanam (Thread Ceremony)
10. Veda Vratham - Prajapatya
11. Veda Vratham - Sowmya
12. Veda Vratham - Aagneya
13. VedaVratham - Vaishvadeva
14. Samavartanam(Snanam)
15. Vivaham(Marriage)
16. Antyeshti (Funeral)
17. Pancha Maha Yagyam - DevaYagya
18. Pancha Maha Yagyam - Pithru Yagya
19. Pancha Maha Yagyam - Bhota Yagya
20. Pancha Maha Yagyam - Manushya Yagya
21. Pancha Maha Yagyam - Bhrama Yagya
22. Sapta Paka Yagyas - Ashtaka
23. Sapta Paka Yagyas - Parvana Stalipaka
24. Sapta Paka Yagyas - Masika Shraaddha
25. Sapta Paka Yagyas - Shravani
26. Sapta Paka Yagyas - Aagrhayani
27. Sapta Paka Yagyas - Chaitree
28. Sapta Paka Yagyas - Aashvayuji
29. Sapta Soma Yagyas - Agnishtomam
30. Sapta Soma Yagyas - Atyagnishtomam
31. Sapta Soma Yagyas - Ukthyam
32. Sapta Soma Yagyas - Shodashi
33. Sapta Soma Yagyas - Vajapeyam
34. Sapta Soma Yagyas - Aptoryamam
35. Sapta Soma Yagyas - Atirattram
36. Sapta Havir Yagyas - Agni Aadheyam
37. Sapta Havir Yagyas - Agnihotram
38. Sapta Havir Yagyas - Darshapoornamasam
39. Sapta Havir Yagyas - Aagrhayanam
40. Sapta Havir Yagyas - Chaturmasyam
41. Sapta Havir Yagyas - Nirudha Pashu Bandham
42. Sapta Havir Yagyas - Soutramanee

If there are any questions on these will answer them or write on them separately. To big to elaborate

smk said...

@jayasree @Ramanathan

Thank you both for the reply

One more thing Brahmins are also called dwijas which means they are born twice.First according to previous birth karmas and doings he is born in brahmin family and when he completes his 7 years upanayanam is done where he is born second who studies and implies knowledge to others as his duty. Isnt this also a fact to be included here.

P.S-IMO it wud be good if there is a article about samskaras in brief.


Murali

R.Ramanathan said...

Sure SMK. Just gimme a weeks time.Am busy with work and also will be out of station. Will do a small write up on the same soon(10 days max)

Ram

smk said...

@Jayasree

I know this is not the place but this is about ramayana and ramasetu.
Also the idea that modern day Sri Lanka is the Lanka of the Ramayana is pure speculation. It does not fit the geography of the Ramayana but rather goes against it. However, if you use the measurements from the Ramayana you will find that Hanuman's journey took him much farther than modern day Sri Lanka. That island was traditionally known as Simhala/Ceylon and was actually attached to the Indian land mass quite recently, in geological terms. The real location of Ravana's Lanka was most probably about 800 miles south of India, near the modern day Chagos isles area and Diego Garcia. Some Vedic Scholars even suggest that Ravana's Lanka was a huge land mass that included Madagascar, Seychelles, Mauritius etc. Also along Hanuman's path there is reportedly a seamount that rises from the ocean floor. It has been suggested that this is the very mount that was offered to Hanuman for his rest, which he refused.

This is from http://veda.harekrsna.cz/library/RamaNavami.zip.

also according to Manavasristhi Vignanam current srilanka was attached to mainland india and ravana lanka was at the equator now submerged.This and above one is poointing to one place and diego garcia is near the equator.

Now to presently called ramasetu according to nasa there was land connecting srilanka about 1750000
years ago at that time due to pralaya it must have been destroyed.

Please tell me your views on above.U could give me your email id if u can.

jayasree said...

Sorry Mr smk, I dont agree with you. There are umpteen number of articles in my blog to substantiate the historicity (yuga et al)and geography of Ram setu and therefore Lanka. Please browse my blogspot and read.

The most recent article that I posted yesterday contains scientifically generated Indian maps based on sea level changes. You can find that Lanka and India were connected by land about 10,000 years ago. By 7000 years ago, the current level of sea level was obtained (map is given) when setu bund was raised.
The link is http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2014/04/toda-connection-to-word-munda-mundas-8.html

At the top of that article I would have given other articles in that series. Read Part 6 of that to know that Ramayana / vanaras lived in a conceivable time period of a few millennia.

At another level, lanka, Ujjaina and Kurukshetra are in the part of earth's axis as per Surya Siddhantha. Your notion of Diego Gracio does not fulfill this aphorism of the siddhantic texts.

On the other hand Diego gracia and Maldives (Malai - theevu) were parts of the Kumari hill range that is an extension of western ghats that run upto Magagascar.

Check this article of mine:-
http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2013/05/is-vedic-astrology-derived-from-greek_16.html

Scroll down to the last illustration shown in that article. It would show the longitude that runs through Somanth (Banasthambh. You can see that going through the sunken extension of western ghats and passes through Diego Gracia etc. That was the route or former habitat of Vaivaswatha Manu and later day (2nd sangam) pandyans. It is possible to retrieve imprints of past Vedic society in that stretch. But that is not related to Ramayana.

jayasree said...

Fyi Mr smk. Mr Ramanathan has sent the article on samskaras as requested by you. I will be posting it on 17th (Friday). I will leave a note in this comment section once I post it.

smk said...

thank you for your view on above about traditional method.

will wait for the article.
thanks

jayasree said...

Dear Mr smk,

Posted the article by Mr Ramanathan on samskaras

http://jayasreesaranathan.blogspot.in/2014/04/an-overview-of-42-samskaras-article-by.html